Algus Posted September 22, 2015 Share Posted September 22, 2015 Well prototype in the sense that "this is the controller we are thinking of going with" All Retro VGS has right now is marketing so you have to run a translation to go from what Mike is saying to what it means in English. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boxpressed Posted September 22, 2015 Share Posted September 22, 2015 Which All-American city manufactures these Retro VGS controllers? Having an All-American product is important to me because, well, America. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
goldenegg Posted September 22, 2015 Share Posted September 22, 2015 All Retro VGS has right now is marketing so you have to run a translation to go from what Mike is saying to what it means in English. The problem with requiring a 'translation' is that it's misleading to anyone who comes to the campaign without knowing all the details. People will think that while they haven't built the system yet, they've at least built a controller. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phoenixdownita Posted September 22, 2015 Share Posted September 22, 2015 There are corded versions of the same controller, which plug in to the GameCube port. There's nothing 'prototype' about it. And everyone knows that the Gamecube port is an exact implementation of the USB protocol. BTW Tiny Knight is not running on real hardware either so I have no idea what controller he's actually holding. That's beside the point. For now, for me protoype controller = look-alike controller, that's it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Algus Posted September 22, 2015 Share Posted September 22, 2015 Oh I don't disagree with you at all. Upthread a bit jaybird3rd pointed out that even if it isn't an intentional scam, it sure smells like one. That is part of the issue of doing something like this while obviously being so ill-prepared. If people didn't know Mike's reputation, they would just assume that (and many have!) I give him the benefit of the doubt from knowing what he's done in the past. There are plenty here and on Neogaf that don't know his reputation and are calling it like they see it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill Loguidice Posted September 22, 2015 Share Posted September 22, 2015 And everyone knows that the Gamecube port is an exact implementation of the USB protocol. BTW Tiny Knight is not running on real hardware either so I have no idea what controller he's actually holding. That's beside the point. For now, for me protoype controller = look-alike controller, that's it. I'm not sure I understand the distinction you're trying to make. It's an off-the-shelf controller that anyone can buy in bulk and customize with their own labeling when ordered direct from the "factory." In the strictest sense it's their prototype controller, but it's obviously not their own design. I see nothing wrong with going that route, frankly, since a good controller is incredibly difficult to design and build with those tolerances, but I'd argue that based on the one I have for my Wii U, it's not exactly a good controller. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
goldenegg Posted September 22, 2015 Share Posted September 22, 2015 (edited) They should simply be open about it, saying that they've chosen a controller manufacturer and have received a USB sample of an existing design to validate that manufacturer's quality. The controller they're proposing has a different button layout, requiring a new PCB from that in the existing model. From the render, it would likely need a new shell too, but I'm willing to bet they'll change their design to match the existing shell. They can say they have a prototype once they get a controller that's made to their specs. They likely don't want to be too open about this, because as Bill has pointed out, that controller is pretty poor. It's definitely not the quality of controller you'd want for a system that's supposed to be usable in 20+ years. Edited September 22, 2015 by goldenegg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mickcris Posted September 22, 2015 Share Posted September 22, 2015 Some "retro" controllers were pretty bad imho like the Atari 5200, intelivision, etc. Maybe they went with a crappy controller to keep with the retro style. 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sh3-rg Posted September 22, 2015 Share Posted September 22, 2015 (edited) Now venn, now venn... Green is around where they originally pitched it and picked up all the facebook followers. "A big shout out to the 15,000+ fb followers, many of whom have been following us from the beginning". Those guys. EDIT: Unless, as was pointed out to me, they bought them from India... lol. Blue is where it appears they think they're going to earn $s and spy an easy opportunity for completed software/well known IP with "pixels". Red is the reason for the facebook backlash prior to their campaign going live. It's not $150-$180.00. The overlaps are pretty fair I think - classic gamer types are not generally the same guys playing faux retro indie games; neither are known to throw their money around needlessly bar a few of the more "serious" collectors as they compete with each other for the rarest of the rare. As stated, Green is the bulk of their following, on fb and elsewhere, that should be their bread and butter. I don't recall many of these guys ever putting a desire to play pseudo retro from pseudo cart on a pseudo console top of any lists. That tiny white bit in the middle where they'll get their pledges, away from friends and good will... all 158 of them so far (186 less 26 @ $10 and $25 levels). If the price was lower, that red section is smaller. If there was some kind of benefit to playing indies on a dedicated offline console box, that blue section is smaller. And if there was a genuine effort to seek out and push for re-released previous titles, follow-ups to existing titles and some real convincing numbers for homebrewers to broaden their audience, the green section is smaller. All of those work towards something more like that smaller diagram with acres of white. But that's probably more "research" and effort on my behalf putting that crap together than whatever this amounted to (from their campaign): 2013 Created initial concept Researched market Edited September 22, 2015 by sh3-rg 11 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AtariTexas Posted September 22, 2015 Share Posted September 22, 2015 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JamesD Posted September 22, 2015 Share Posted September 22, 2015 Are you sure that shouldn't say down instead of up? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PlaysWithWolves Posted September 22, 2015 Share Posted September 22, 2015 I'm curious if Interworks is going to be able to provide matching buttons at a reasonable cost: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mickcris Posted September 22, 2015 Share Posted September 22, 2015 12 hours later they are at 185 backers and $65,510. Oops. "YOU'RE GOING THE WRONG WAY!!!" R.I.P. John Candy. Down to 182 now. Totally going the wrong way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AtariTexas Posted September 22, 2015 Share Posted September 22, 2015 (edited) Usually there is a flurry of activity as far as donations from backers the first couple days. Usually after that, you have to fight for every dollar. I say when its all said and done with backers jumping in and out, they finish at 66,666 dollars Now for a little "Shout at the Devil" by Motley Crue Pops in CD oh yeaaaah Edited September 22, 2015 by BadHornet Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaybird3rd Posted September 22, 2015 Share Posted September 22, 2015 Down to 182 now. Totally going the wrong way. Yep. According to my midnight numbers, they lost seven backers yesterday, which brought them to 186 at the start of the day today. They've since lost five more backers, worth a total of $1187, and they picked up one backer, worth $50. That puts them at 182 backers with a net loss of $1137 for the day. So far. I think it was already a foregone conclusion that they wouldn't make their goal, but now I can't help but wonder when (not if) they're going to pull the plug early to save face. For their sakes, I hope it happens sooner rather than later. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CGQuarterly Posted September 22, 2015 Share Posted September 22, 2015 They should REALLY pull the plug on the campaign and regroup. This is really just a circus at this point. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StopDrop&Retro Posted September 22, 2015 Share Posted September 22, 2015 (edited) 12 hours later they are at 185 backers and $65,510. Oops. "YOU'RE GOING THE WRONG WAY!!!" Now it's at 182 backers Edit: old news is fun Edited September 22, 2015 by StopDrop&Retro Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
toiletunes Posted September 22, 2015 Share Posted September 22, 2015 Not to beat a dead horse, but I made my own Venn.. 9 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phoenixdownita Posted September 22, 2015 Share Posted September 22, 2015 (edited) I'm not sure I understand the distinction you're trying to make. It's an off-the-shelf controller that anyone can buy in bulk and customize with their own labeling when ordered direct from the "factory." In the strictest sense it's their prototype controller, but it's obviously not their own design. I see nothing wrong with going that route, frankly, since a good controller is incredibly difficult to design and build with those tolerances, but I'd argue that based on the one I have for my Wii U, it's not exactly a good controller. I'm with you in this. I was pointing out that dissing them because they are using a common manufacturer once they actually said they were it's a non starter for the "diss them" train and there likely is some minor work to be done on it hence "prototype" may be alright as a word although the poster didn't like the fact that they "claimed" it was "their design" or something along those lines. I am actually tired of the "diss them" campaign, although I agree they should stop, regroup, come up with a real proposal either KS for a prototype and see where that goes or build their spec and a proto for it and then campaign again. Given Mike is the President of the company (more like fellowship at this point), he's behavior has been extremely unprofessional, for a President position it is a clear "no hire" if you ask me, but he is well intentioned and passionate (no doubt about it) ... but the car salesman techniques he's employing so far are really not shining a good light. I think CJ put it correctly: The more they get close to the funding the more they are doing damage control .... not a good sign. To be fair, ParrotHead is more Damage than Control. Edited September 22, 2015 by phoenixdownita 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+remowilliams Posted September 22, 2015 Share Posted September 22, 2015 Not to beat a dead horse, but I made my own Venn.. Hmm, I think I may see a problem... 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaybird3rd Posted September 22, 2015 Share Posted September 22, 2015 Hmm, I think I may see a problem... Me, too. The circles should be farther apart. I think they need another sizzle reel. Shinier 3D renders should stop the bleeding. Maybe some more potato camera shots of their "prototype" controller, too. 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PlaysWithWolves Posted September 22, 2015 Share Posted September 22, 2015 Ouch at losing people. They should REALLY pull the plug on the campaign and regroup. This is really just a circus at this point. I think the community would forgive if they came back in six months with a ready-for-production functional prototype and are more specific on hardware details. As I suggested weeks ago, take it to conventions and let people see it running -- if not try it out. That, or carry on with this strategy: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sh3-rg Posted September 22, 2015 Share Posted September 22, 2015 WP_20150922_14_45_05_Pro.jpgNot to beat a dead horse, but I made my own Venn.. 15 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Radfoo Posted September 22, 2015 Share Posted September 22, 2015 (edited) They just haven't thought things through properly. Think the project is a bit lost, it was the FPGA side that got me interested and I think that was a hook for lots of others, as soon as they started talking to devs they realised ARM was better for them, think they should have made a choice at that point to go one way or the other with the CPU. Although I am more interested in an FPGA system I think Retro VGS, should cancel indiegogo and go back to the beagleboard black type idea and sell these things at there original price point of $150. People would buy it, devs would be happy with lots more customers. I might even buy it then, though as I said my interest is in either kevtris FPGA board or maybe MIST. Its all a bit sad, starting to feel sorry for them now. Any bets on when they will cancel the indiegogo campaign? Edited September 22, 2015 by Radfoo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sh3-rg Posted September 22, 2015 Share Posted September 22, 2015 Pretty soon there's going to be more people in this thread than there are back... no... nope... let's just say this is a popular thread. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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