Nintendo Classic Mini announced

[godslabrat]

heh I realize you're just playing, but anyone serious would at least add tax + shipping (and yes, a little something something) to the offer. I believe I payed about $65 at Target. so not even I would sell it at 60 bucks even IF I wanted to sell "retail". I'd say a reasonable "lowball" offer would be in the realm of 80-90 bucks.

 

If I was shopping for one today, and I was desperate... while I wouldn't consider $300, I WOULD consider up to $120 (i.e. double) but that'd be about my ceiling.. The reality at this point is these things are no longer available, and they are desired.

 

I'm not saying he couldn't have gotten tax + shipping + a little something extra out of me, if he were truly open to negotiation. I might pay $10, or slightly more, as a finder's fee, but there's no way I'm paying double what the thing is worth... and to me, it's "worth" MSRP, because once you start paying more than $75 for it, you start getting into the realm of other products that might be a better use of your funds.

[NE146]

yes but do you want a product to play NES games.. because as you said there are tons of options for that.

 

Or do you want the the NES Mini model, poster, box and pad, etc. Big difference.. it's not about function.

[Flojomojo]

He doesn't want to buy anything, he just wants to troll the scalpers.

[+GoldLeader]

The knock-offs are kinda cute:

 

http://www.ebay.com/itm/NEW-Console-Entertainment-System-Mini-Classic-Games-Retro-Nintendo-NES-PAL-NTSC/182609666573?_trksid=p2047675.c100005.m1851&_trkparms=aid%3D222007%26algo%3DSIC.MBE%26ao%3D1%26asc%3D41375%26meid%3D7157666def8249f8be1017dda4d53427%26pid%3D100005%26rk%3D4%26rkt%3D6%26sd%3D252968345236&rt=nc

[atarilovesyou]

Your extension cord will not contribute to lag. 10 meters is far smaller than one microsecond at the near speed of light electricity travels at. One TV frame is 16 milliseconds or 16700 microseconds.

 

 

 

Pat Contri on CUPodcast recommended against the controller extensions and in favor of an extra-long HDMI cable due to lag issues. That may be where this is coming from, and I doubt he's alone in this.

 

However, I agree with you, and respectfully disagree with Pat. Lag issues are going to be almost entirely on the TV side, not the console.

 

I can only go by personal experience, but I noticed 'something' with the cable being used...picked it up 8 out of 10 times using a particular SMB jump. The thing is, it's not like the unit itself is lag-free, as Pat mentioned. That said, with just the system hooked up via a good HDMI cable and my tv set on game mode, SMB is playable by and large. The big jump in 8-1 or wherever it is will probably still be a pain in the ass to nail, regardless.

 

I've come to the conclusion that the Classic is best looked at as nostalgia bait, and that the best way to enjoy these games is on the original hardware using a CRT. I know people will disagree with me, but until I try an emulator setup that mimics the response of the controllers (even these newer controllers have a different feel from a good ol' broken in pair...and exhibit that breakdown FAR faster than the original pads), that's my take on it.

 

I'd sell my mini if I could, but it's just too cool of a concept...it belongs in my collection.

 

Has anybody made an emulator like this with A/V or composite outs? Maybe that would be something for me to look into. I've given up on the whole HDMI thing for NES, but it's not like I've looked too deep. I was into getting that AVI unit, what's it called over at retrousb?...but it's expensive, and may exhibit the same lag issues as the Classic (or maybe not: I just don't want to spend that kinda scratch to find out).

[Tanooki]

IMG_5204.PNG

 

And I again offer $60. :-)

 

Just in case there was any doubt that these scalpers are entitled twits, here ya go.

 

Well he is a dumbass, perhaps to him it means Morons Suggested Retail Pricing? If he thinks it is worth that, let alone dares to suggest it retailed for that, he's a moron. Hmmm... Morons Suggested Rectal Pounding at that price. Hopefully more people troll him. The fact he's demanding $300 is the only rude statement there. I agree with NE there, fair price would be around $80-90 given price, state tax, his time and gas money to bring it to you. The added $15-25 covers that extra with a little tip of sorts, but $100, let alone $300, he can die in a fire.

 

Good job trolling the guy, everyone should jump in on that action.

[Andromeda Stardust]

 

Pat Contri on CUPodcast recommended against the controller extensions and in favor of an extra-long HDMI cable due to lag issues. That may be where this is coming from, and I doubt he's alone in this.

 

However, I agree with you, and respectfully disagree with Pat. Lag issues are going to be almost entirely on the TV side, not the console.

There's a more technical explanation that warrants describing. Electricity travels through copper at nearly the speed of light. In reality it is slightly slower by a few percentage points due to resistance and propigation delay of the atoms or some such nonsense but I digress.

 

There is a limit to the length of an extension cable can be. For USB 2.0, the maximum cable length is only 3 meters because the components have to respond to communication protocols instantly. Other communication standards such as CAT 5/6 ethernet, allow much longer runs that can exceed the wavelenth of the communication signal due to separate twisted pairs for send and receive.

 

Beyond that, there is signal degradation due to parallel capacitance and series resistance and inductance. So provide a long enough rope, and losses will cause communication protocol to fail. I tested retrobit brand extension cables with my SNES. Six cables worked fine, but seven cables and my controller abruptly failed to respond.

 

So the way a game controller works generally, except for direct connected peripherals like Atari joysticks, is the game console sends a request or poll to the game controller to return the values on each of the buttons. The game controller then responds by transmitting the state of each input, typically in series for most modern consoles, back to the console. There is normally a clock signal on one of the wires which provides the timing protocol by which the controller sends out the bits, however modern USB controllers use a different method which I won't get into here.

 

NES/SNES controller protocol uses five wires, ground, VCC, latch, clock, and data. The NES polls the controller by sending a latch signal, which the controller then transmits the first bit, then the NES sends data pulses for each remaining bit. I forget how many microseconds the controller has to respond, but if the cable length exceeds this, the controller poll will fail or result an error. I am not familiar with the Wiimote protocol, though I suspect it is similar to Game Cube. Anyway, the Classic controller has some finite amount of time to respond to the request from the console before an error occurs. So the theoretical maximum cable length would be half the distance light travels in this window of time (since the signal must travel to the controller and back) minus the propigation delay of the logic chips in the controller and console.

 

Of course this is best case assuming an electrically perfect impedance matched cable. The signals do not rely on balanced twisted pairs as with CAT5/6 ethernet or even HDMI, so signal losses within the cable may degrade the signal such that the maximum cable length is nowhere near the theoretical maximum length. I have no idea what this maximum length is, but generally the higher speed the signal, the shorter the length must be kept.

 

Then there's the Turbo tap. It has a pathetic 3-foot cable as do the controllers. Ideally, an extension cable between the console and the turbo tap, then two or more friends plug their controllers into the tap across the room. Oh no! The turbo tap absolutely doesn't function with anything longer than it's stock cord, so you need a separate extension cable for each player. Why it does this, I have no clue, because the Turbografx is controlled by a 7Mhz clock, and you would need a seriously long cable to approach that wavelength.

 

Anyone with bulk extensions, feel free to daisychain them up until the controller fails or behaves erraticly. Ten extra feet certainly provides ample breathing room and works just fine.

[Andromeda Stardust]

The knock-offs are kinda cute:

 

http://www.ebay.com/itm/NEW-Console-Entertainment-System-Mini-Classic-Games-Retro-Nintendo-NES-PAL-NTSC/182609666573?_trksid=p2047675.c100005.m1851&_trkparms=aid%3D222007%26algo%3DSIC.MBE%26ao%3D1%26asc%3D41375%26meid%3D7157666def8249f8be1017dda4d53427%26pid%3D100005%26rk%3D4%26rkt%3D6%26sd%3D252968345236&rt=nc

Good old pirate 500-in-1.

https://www.aliexpress.com/store/product/Mini-TV-Handheld-Game-Console-Video-Game-Console-For-Nes-Games-with-500-Different-Built-in/2623023_32808605208.html

 

But I wouldn't buy one off the eBay reseller. These have got to come out of a factory in China somewhere. If I knowingly buy bootleg goods, I'll get them at Aliexpress. Kinda like I paid $17 shipped for my 150-in-1 NES cart (actually I bought two as one of them was for a friend) while these reseller asshats were selling them all day long on eBay and Etsy and Amazon at $50 a piece.

 

Besides, I got the original!

[Zonie]

It's funny, I was in Beijing and Tianjin earlier this year and couldn't find ANYTHING even vaguely resembling this or any western gaming system other than the current PS4 and Wii stuff.

I mostly got deer in the headlights looks from shopkeepers even showing them photos of this on my phone. Even in the mega warehouse type building with thousands of stalls selling everything under the sun, meant for locals, not foreigners; nothing, nada. I did find about 5 LEGO knockoff brands. I bought a "Lepin" . "STAR WNRS" (yes, that "N" is there on purpose) X-wing for $18 bucks, with a "SPACE WARS" assembly guide inside it with a different brand, but no Nintendo anything. BTW, the Lego knockoff was very good quality.

Same thing for Taiwan. Nothing but what we can find here (PS4, etc) but i was able to get my NES classics in Taipei.

 

500 games is too many. I think one would spend a lot of time scrolling to the game they want... 30 is about right.

Edited June 7, 2017 by Zonie

[godslabrat]

yes but do you want a product to play NES games.. because as you said there are tons of options for that.

 

Or do you want the the NES Mini model, poster, box and pad, etc. Big difference.. it's not about function.

 

 

He doesn't want to buy anything, he just wants to troll the scalpers.

 

Oh, I want to do all the above.

 

IMO, it's nothing more than scalpers saying "I'll sell for this amount" and me saying "I'll buy for that amount."

[+MrBlackCat]

All the drama surrounding this console has gotten to be no fun to me. I just wanted it to be over... so bought a used one with no box or anything for $125.00 I just want a unit and to be done with it. The sense of relief is more than I expected. It was no longer an enjoyable toy-hunt for me.

This thread started off so positive... a shame. (Thanks Nintendo, grumble,grumble,grumble)

Just a few days and maybe all this silly Nintendo craving will be satisfied... then I can return focus to the next releases of AtGames consoles. That new Genesis is SO freakin' cute! Can't wait!

 

Oh, and thanks GoldLeader for the heads up on those knockoff "Chinendo Mini's" with 500 games... as a general gamer, I try to get as many of those different types of units as I have time to try out. I ordered one of those also.

 

MrBlackCat

Edited June 8, 2017 by MrBlackCat

[Dashopepper]

 

Played just fine with 3 extensions, and I can be a snob when it comes to lag in SMB 1.

[atarilovesyou]

There's a more technical explanation that warrants describing. Electricity travels through copper at nearly the speed of light. In reality it is slightly slower by a few percentage points due to resistance and propigation delay of the atoms or some such nonsense but I digress.

 

There is a limit to the length of an extension cable can be. For USB 2.0, the maximum cable length is only 3 meters because the components have to respond to communication protocols instantly. Other communication standards such as CAT 5/6 ethernet, allow much longer runs that can exceed the wavelenth of the communication signal due to separate twisted pairs for send and receive.

 

Beyond that, there is signal degradation due to parallel capacitance and series resistance and inductance. So provide a long enough rope, and losses will cause communication protocol to fail. I tested retrobit brand extension cables with my SNES. Six cables worked fine, but seven cables and my controller abruptly failed to respond.

 

So the way a game controller works generally, except for direct connected peripherals like Atari joysticks, is the game console sends a request or poll to the game controller to return the values on each of the buttons. The game controller then responds by transmitting the state of each input, typically in series for most modern consoles, back to the console. There is normally a clock signal on one of the wires which provides the timing protocol by which the controller sends out the bits, however modern USB controllers use a different method which I won't get into here.

 

NES/SNES controller protocol uses five wires, ground, VCC, latch, clock, and data. The NES polls the controller by sending a latch signal, which the controller then transmits the first bit, then the NES sends data pulses for each remaining bit. I forget how many microseconds the controller has to respond, but if the cable length exceeds this, the controller poll will fail or result an error. I am not familiar with the Wiimote protocol, though I suspect it is similar to Game Cube. Anyway, the Classic controller has some finite amount of time to respond to the request from the console before an error occurs. So the theoretical maximum cable length would be half the distance light travels in this window of time (since the signal must travel to the controller and back) minus the propigation delay of the logic chips in the controller and console.

 

Of course this is best case assuming an electrically perfect impedance matched cable. The signals do not rely on balanced twisted pairs as with CAT5/6 ethernet or even HDMI, so signal losses within the cable may degrade the signal such that the maximum cable length is nowhere near the theoretical maximum length. I have no idea what this maximum length is, but generally the higher speed the signal, the shorter the length must be kept.

 

Then there's the Turbo tap. It has a pathetic 3-foot cable as do the controllers. Ideally, an extension cable between the console and the turbo tap, then two or more friends plug their controllers into the tap across the room. Oh no! The turbo tap absolutely doesn't function with anything longer than it's stock cord, so you need a separate extension cable for each player. Why it does this, I have no clue, because the Turbografx is controlled by a 7Mhz clock, and you would need a seriously long cable to approach that wavelength.

 

Anyone with bulk extensions, feel free to daisychain them up until the controller fails or behaves erraticly. Ten extra feet certainly provides ample breathing room and works just fine.

 

Thanks for the explanations. I like that you mentioned the Turbotap...now I don't need to bother to try that solution

 

All I can say is that I wish I couldn't notice the lag, but I consistently do. I also noticed the sound lag from the get-go, that was even before youtube reviewers were calling out the issue (I actually only read it on two sites, but found out for myself). People here on this site will still swear up and down there isn't any sound lag, but there it is. I'm not looking to convert anybody, I just "knows what I knows"

 

The controller lag I'm experiencing could be fluke, or something with the stock mini controllers. I've noticed they don't have the same kind of feel as the originals, although they're still very good. Over the decades, one gets very familiar with what those brand spankin' new controllers feel like: the spring, the bounce. Until they become worn in, and given enough time, really worn in. I have a relatively light touch, though, so most of my NES pads from back in the day are still not that bad. Anyways...there are so many reasons for lag on today's systems that it's hard to pinpoint where it's likely coming from. The TVs have to be the biggest source, and I can say that my tv isn't the best in this regard. It's about 7 years old, a Samsung Series 5. It has a game mode, but I don't think it's available using HDMI input. I could be wrong. I currently play my Wii on it with component cables and don't notice any lag.

 

I do, however, notice lag when I use my PS2 on it...without using game mode. With game mode on, no problem. It took a while at getting my normally pretty good Guitar Hero scores back before I figured out lag was an issue. The main headaches I had with lag had nothing to do with video games, but rather getting my Bluray player, receiver and everything else to play nice. I was getting lag with my Bluray player when it was going through my receiver (with HDMI through-puts), but directly into my tv's HDMI, no problem. I had to replace the receiver to get the audio lag to go away, but even then just eventually went to taking the optical out from the tv directly to the receiver rather than keep it all HDMI-centric. I have no problems with lag anymore for my movies, but not until I bought Monster HDMI cables and all that jazz...probably not necessary, but there you go.

 

I do miss the fact that CRT tvs never had lag issues, but that's progress for you. I don't know what I'll do when my Samsung dies, as it has component inputs, computer inputs, all sorts of inputs. Newer tvs seem to have just HDMI. Yuck.

 

Using an X-Arcade with my Playstation 2 (and early adaptor), there was a definite lag. So that's when I started just going direct to my computer and going MAME. Not as much lag, but I still get much better response time using my computer video output (the name of that connector escapes me) into my HDTV than by using HDMI from my laptop. Then, it's lag city. I blame HDMI, and plenty of folks at our local high end Audio Video store agree (or at least agreed five years ago when I was still dealing with lag). They weren't fans of HDMI for that very reason.

 

Oddly enough, I get the best modern NES gameplay by simply hooking it up to my Samsung, turning on 4:3 ratio and turning on game mode. I sense ZERO lag, and have the Gradius scores to prove it Turn off the game mode, though, it's lag city. Smoother display, but I actually prefer the game mode picture quality over the HD version. So that's been my 'modern' solution to playing NES. I still play games on my CRT in the mancave all the time, but whenever the NES makes the trek upstairs, I use it in that fashion and honestly don't suffer at all. I should take some video some time to show how well it works....I hear nothing but complaints when people connect their NES to HD tvs, but in my case, setup the way I like it, I don't miss out at all.

 

Which is why my NES Classic is largely just a collectible rather than my go-to NES machine. I do have to say this: I love the save states. Let me tell you how great THAT is...in fact, so much so that I'm seriously considering getting an NES Everdrive mainly for that function (I already have a Powerpak, though, so it's hard to justify). Save states just let me work away at tough spots, and then play when I can....work, family, all those things. Getting old school gaming done, say, Battletoads, and having to grind 30 minutes just to get to the level you want to practice gets pretty old. It's a great tool to practice.

 

Sorry for the book, but that's about all I gots ta say about all things NES for the time being

[Andromeda Stardust]

@atarilovesyou: HDTVs are a crap shoot when it comes to lag. I use a 1080p PC monitor for gaming, not an HDTV. No overscan, no weird scaling ratios, less than one frame of lag. Split off the analog audio to a good hifi stereo using a Monoprice HDMI switch and I'm set.

 

Modern consoles often have discrete surround sound and other stuffs piped through HDMI, and your amp/receiver and HDTV work in tandem to ensure the audio and video signals stay in sync by the HDTV communicating to the receiver how much display lag it has so the receiver can delay the audio by the exact same amount. So you've got two sources of lag communicating with each other and trying to stay in sync, whic adds to the delay of the final product.

 

HDMI switches do not add lag since they merely pass the signal unaltered between the console and the display, and the fact that the audio portion of the signal is not HDCP encrypted means you can pass it off. However this means only encoded surround or Dolby Digital can be passed through to SPDIF output on the switch (and many game consoles do not encode discrete PCM to Dolby Digital), so you can't get discrete PCM channels or high definition audio codecs out. The stereo downmix generally works well with Pro Logic receivers so you can still get simulated surround sound if not discrete surround, without resorting to an HDMI receiver that only adds lag to the video chain, in addition to whatever the display adds.

 

TL;DR: Use a 1080p PC monitor coupled with an HDMI switch to bypass Pro Logic encoded stereo to a receiver for absolute minimal lag when HD gaming. Yes, you may lose audio fidelity or settle for a smaller screen, but in the end it is worth it.

 

Also it is worth noting that the NES Classic Mini does add lag to the games beyond what ie and FPGA clone like the AVS or NT Mini would do. All software based emulators require a frame buffer. When you add up all contributing sources of lag to the daisy chain (triple buffered emulation -> audio receiver -> HDTV) it can get bad quickly.

[+GoldLeader]

FWIW, Any lag I've ever had in the past has come down to "Game Mode", or lack thereof. In Game Mode everything was peachy (generally). But I think it has to be bad for me to notice. And of course it seems to vary by TV make, hell probably even model. Just off the top of my head and talking casually, from my (usually bad) memory; I liked SONY, PHILIPS, and PANASONIC and disliked LG...Hated LG. Of course a lot of that was before HDMI...

 

Anyhow I don't recall having lag problems with this, but I've barely had any time to really try it out, so I might be not noticing.

 

I did go a little nuts and get some stuff for it though

 

Edited June 12, 2017 by GoldLeader

[Tanooki]

You're right it's everything about game mode, but in general a low MS rating on the lag. That's why displaylag.com exists, you can research a TV before you buy it or pick one up second hand to see if that specific model number falls into a range. I know i said it enough before, but 30ms seems to be the sweet spot. The lower your ms lag rating under that the better you are. A middle 20s is ideal before you get into computer level LCDs.

 

Ive suffered from it before on a higher than 30ms tv and not on others since. Its real and thats basically that People whining about it blaming Nintendo are just whining out of frustration as their TV doesn't cut it. Wired controllers, and other mythical unicorns like extension cords and HDMI plugs are not to blame, nor is Nintendo's emulator. Your TV sucks or it doesn't, period. Hate it that bad, buy a dedicated 20" or so LCD meant for a computer which has a HDMI input on it.

[godslabrat]

You're right it's everything about game mode, but in general a low MS rating on the lag. That's why displaylag.com exists, you can research a TV before you buy it or pick one up second hand to see if that specific model number falls into a range. I know i said it enough before, but 30ms seems to be the sweet spot. The lower your ms lag rating under that the better you are. A middle 20s is ideal before you get into computer level LCDs.

 

Ive suffered from it before on a higher than 30ms tv and not on others since. Its real and thats basically that People whining about it blaming Nintendo are just whining out of frustration as their TV doesn't cut it. Wired controllers, and other mythical unicorns like extension cords and HDMI plugs are not to blame, nor is Nintendo's emulator. Your TV sucks or it doesn't, period. Hate it that bad, buy a dedicated 20" or so LCD meant for a computer which has a HDMI input on it.

Some people say the lag is bad, some don't. The NES Classic is the same across the board, ergo, the TV is the variable.

[Tanooki]

Exactly. I've used 2 of them on 3 different TVs so far and each ran without timing problems (lag.) I know if I put it on a 4th tv I have it would work, but if i put it on my infamously annoying big screen samsung it would lag like a bitch. It's the TV years ago that made me think the emulation of Mario Allstars Wii was broken and I sold the game off shortly after buying it because I couldn't make basic jumps in SMB3.

[Andromeda Stardust]

FWIW, Any lag I've ever had in the past has come down to "Game Mode", or lack thereof. In Game Mode everything was peachy (generally). But I think it has to be bad for me to notice. And of course it seems to vary by TV make, hell probably even model. Just off the top of my head and talking casually, from my (usually bad) memory; I liked SONY, PHILIPS, and PANASONIC and disliked LG...Hated LG. Of course a lot of that was before HDMI...

 

Anyhow I don't recall having lag problems with this, but I've barely had any time to really try it out, so I might be not noticing.

 

I did go a little nuts and get some stuff for it though

 

Wow, that's a nice little collection there. Mind my asking what is the transparent red device middle-left?

[SignGuy81]

Just wanted to add a tip besides just game mode(this may be included also in game mode on some TVs) but also make sure that the TV has overscan turned off. A lot of sets(even newer smart TVs) still use this feature and is turned on at factory. If this is turned on, lets say it is a 1080p TV and you are giving it a 1080p signal, your TV is still scaling the image(which takes time), unless that feature is turned off.

 

EDIT:

Just want to add too that setting the TV to game mode might already take care of that I'm not sure.

Edited June 13, 2017 by SignGuy81

[Andromeda Stardust]

Just wanted to add a tip besides just game mode(this may be included also in game mode on some TVs) but also make sure that the TV has overscan turned off. A lot of sets(even newer smart TVs) still use this feature and is turned on at factory. If this is turned on, lets say it is a 1080p TV and you are giving it a 1080p signal, your TV is still scaling the image(which takes time), unless that feature is turned off.

 

EDIT:

Just want to add too that setting the TV to game mode might already take care of that I'm not sure.

Most HDTVs do not have options to control overscan. That's another +1 for using a 1080p PC monitor for games.

[Schizophretard]

You're right it's everything about game mode, but in general a low MS rating on the lag. That's why displaylag.com exists, you can research a TV before you buy it or pick one up second hand to see if that specific model number falls into a range. I know i said it enough before, but 30ms seems to be the sweet spot. The lower your ms lag rating under that the better you are. A middle 20s is ideal before you get into computer level LCDs.

 

Ive suffered from it before on a higher than 30ms tv and not on others since. Its real and thats basically that People whining about it blaming Nintendo are just whining out of frustration as their TV doesn't cut it. Wired controllers, and other mythical unicorns like extension cords and HDMI plugs are not to blame, nor is Nintendo's emulator. Your TV sucks or it doesn't, period. Hate it that bad, buy a dedicated 20" or so LCD meant for a computer which has a HDMI input on it.

 

I don't really see much of difference between someone who has already acquired an NES Classic Edition but is whining because their solution for lag is to buy a new TV and someone who already has a good TV but is whining because their solution for getting an NES Classic Edition is to buy one from a reseller that is charging prices that you could buy a new TV for. Both seem to be frustration with how much disposable income one has and over around the same price range to get it all up and running.

 

I also don't see how Nintendo wouldn't be blameless for one but not the other. Them choosing to make it a limited edition collectors item causes the reseller issue but lowers the chances of the lag issue because the people most likely to get it are more likely to choose TV's or monitors with gaming in mind. On the other hand, if they made it a mass market device intended for millions of people then that causes the lag issue because they are selling a device best used on TV's or monitors with gaming in mind to people that may not even be gamers and, therefore, just have TV's that were purchased without gaming in mind.

[+GoldLeader]

Wow, that's a nice little collection there. Mind my asking what is the transparent red device middle-left?

 

Thanks Kosmic!,

 

That's a Mayflash adapter to use regular NES pads on Wii and NES Classic! (Also has SNES controller inputs.)

[Classic Pac]

From you know this had to happen dept. There is this one guy on Ebay selling these things for $349 each and it seems his supply isn't limited.

[Professor Gull]

I saw another one available in my local retro game store but didn't snag it up. I sense there will be trickle effect in my area locally for these to get returned for more money then they were bought for. If the $129.00 price tag for them used keeps them flowing I can see them going in and out of the stores here.

 

Still its sad to think this little limited run was all the consumers will get.