CX40_Plus Posted August 6, 2016 Share Posted August 6, 2016 Wanted to share a prototype I've been working on and get your thoughts. CX40+ is a drop-in replacement board for the classic Atari joystick that ditches the flaky dome switches of the original with new, tactile switches similar to those found in the Neo Geo Pocket. The replacement is easy, requiring only three minutes and screwdriver. This more modern approach gives a much more positive, "clicky" feel while being considerably more durable and responsive. I would love to be able to save one or two CX40s out of the trash, so am considering a short production run in the future. The photos below are of the first version and I expect a couple of revisions before I'm happy. What does everyone think? 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wickeycolumbus Posted August 6, 2016 Share Posted August 6, 2016 That's a great idea, I think many people would be interested in that. Great first post 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BassGuitari Posted August 6, 2016 Share Posted August 6, 2016 (edited) Very cool! I have a box full of malfunctioning CX40s that these would be great to fix up with. Keep us posted on these!Any idea on a price point for these if/when you get to production?EDIT: Welcome to AtariAge! Edited August 6, 2016 by BassGuitari 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BassGuitari Posted August 6, 2016 Share Posted August 6, 2016 (edited) That's a great idea, I think many people would be interested in that. Great first post Right? Just kinda shows up out of nowhere with these, and I'm thinking, "who wouldn't want these?" Edited August 6, 2016 by BassGuitari 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+save2600 Posted August 6, 2016 Share Posted August 6, 2016 I'd love to try a couple out when you're ready to release them... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CX40_Plus Posted August 7, 2016 Author Share Posted August 7, 2016 Thanks for the kind words! Any idea on a price point for these if/when you get to production? I haven't yet costed them. My hope would be to keep them under $25USD shipped. However a lot depends on if I assemble or have them assembled, size of the batch and final components. I'm still testing different switches. There are currently two prototypes that use different tact switches, but I don't think either are perfect. Which I decided to go for and who can supply them will have a big impact on the cost. I'd love to try a couple out when you're ready to release them... I'd like to get some of the next revision prototypes in to the hands of AtariAge members for review! Do you think there's specific people I should be talking to in the community about the project? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AtariBrian Posted August 7, 2016 Share Posted August 7, 2016 25 shipped for one board ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CX40_Plus Posted August 7, 2016 Author Share Posted August 7, 2016 25 shipped for one board ? Uncertain. My aim is to keep them under that. In small quantities the cost of materials and postage is around $10 per board, that's ignoring any assembly, testing costs, returns, overage, yield etc. I'd need to do a full costing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AtariBrian Posted August 7, 2016 Share Posted August 7, 2016 Best Electronics sells their brand new gold boards for 8.75 each so I guess I don't see a point to putting money into doing this . 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
walter_J64bit Posted August 7, 2016 Share Posted August 7, 2016 (edited) I've just did the Best Electronics gold upgrade for my two XEGS CX40's but it's nice to see this enhanced replacement board for the CX40. :thumbsup: Edited August 7, 2016 by walter_J64bit Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thecrypticodor Posted August 7, 2016 Share Posted August 7, 2016 Honestly I never understood the appeal of buying replacement PCB's. All you need to do is pull up the old tape clean the board and contacts than just tape back down the dome switches with packing tape. I've done this to a half a dozen CX-40’s over the years and they always function like new afterward. Even if the dome switches are worn out it's not hard to find replacements. http://www.aliexpress.com/w/wholesale-metal-dome-switch-tactile.html?spm=2114.01010208.0.52.cKB2Hf&site=glo&SearchText=metal+dome+switch+tactile&g=y&SortType=price_asc&groupsort=1&initiative_id=SB_20160807081704&shipCountry=us 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AtariBrian Posted August 7, 2016 Share Posted August 7, 2016 I and many people have tried that and if you use them after a short time they end up moving and having issues . The Best electronics boards are the best quality and solution . 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thecrypticodor Posted August 7, 2016 Share Posted August 7, 2016 (edited) I and many people have tried that and if you use them after a short time they end up moving and having issues . The Best electronics boards are the best quality and solution . Never had that happen to me. I did most of mine in the early 2000's and they're still perfect. I've seen guides that say to cut out squares around the domes in the original tape and that definitely would cause movement and poor adhesion of the new tape. You need to remove all of the original tape and re-wrap the the board, Also adding a thin layer of dialectic grease will held retard future corrosion of the metal contact surfaces. Edited August 7, 2016 by thecrypticodor Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CX40_Plus Posted August 7, 2016 Author Share Posted August 7, 2016 Thanks for the feedback everyone - it's been super helpful. Seems like the thoughts are: The price would have to be more comparable to dome switch solutions on the market The primary decision to pick one up would be as a repair than a feel / performance upgrade Also, I notice that Best Electronics require the purchase of two boards. Would people be okay if these board were only available as pairs? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BassGuitari Posted August 7, 2016 Share Posted August 7, 2016 (edited) Best Electronics sells their brand new gold boards for 8.75 each so I guess I don't see a point to putting money into doing this . Microswitches, that's why. Sure, you can mod existing boards if you want, but if there's a brand new board that has them from the get-go and you don't feel like/have time for modding old ones yourself, why not? Would people be okay if these board were only available as pairs? Wouldn't bother me! Edited August 7, 2016 by BassGuitari Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+save2600 Posted August 7, 2016 Share Posted August 7, 2016 Yes, sold in pairs is fine and agree about pricing being competitive of course. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andromeda Stardust Posted August 7, 2016 Share Posted August 7, 2016 Microswitches, that's why. Sure, you can mod existing boards if you want, but if there's a brand new board that has them from the get-go and you don't feel like/have time for modding old ones yourself, why not? Wouldn't bother me! Another thing to consider is the normal microswitch contacts typically sit about 3-4mm above the board while the classic dome switches are handle one mm high. This will drastically change the feel of the joystick and require modding of the joystick housing and/or actuator to compensate for the height difference. There are special low profile microswitches do exist, but these are more expensive and only marginally better than the domes. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AtariBrian Posted August 7, 2016 Share Posted August 7, 2016 And dome switches are typically to hard and don't have the feedback that a dome switch has . So I doubt anyone wants to be filing down parts of the joystick . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BassGuitari Posted August 7, 2016 Share Posted August 7, 2016 Another thing to consider is the normal microswitch contacts typically sit about 3-4mm above the board while the classic dome switches are handle one mm high. This will drastically change the feel of the joystick and require modding of the joystick housing and/or actuator to compensate for the height difference. That's part of the reason I haven't bothered to fix up spare broken CX40s this way. Lots of filing and fiddling around. Which is why I like these boards; those microswitches look pretty close to the height of original dome switches. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CX40_Plus Posted August 7, 2016 Author Share Posted August 7, 2016 (edited) There's no modification of the existing joystick plastic required. The switches in the current prototype are surface mount, so very low profile. The tact switches are slightly higher than the original dome switches, which means the throw of joystick is much shorter. This makes the stick (and the fire button) feel more responsive. I've attached an image below. Edited August 7, 2016 by CX40_Plus 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+save2600 Posted August 7, 2016 Share Posted August 7, 2016 Looks good! Throw might be a lot different than many people would expect though. Might actually *want* to file down the nub/nipple off the actuator, huh? Don't want too great a throw either, but that nipple filed down might just be the ticket to feeling as "natural" as possible for such a mod? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andromeda Stardust Posted August 7, 2016 Share Posted August 7, 2016 I would rather have a bit shorter throw with snappy response than a stiff joystick that's difficult to actuate. I'm wondering if these will make the original joystick better than the FB2 sticks. The FB2 have silicone rubber pads with carbon dots. It's way better than a crunchy CX-40 but the button response feels spongy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+save2600 Posted August 7, 2016 Share Posted August 7, 2016 Yeah, don't care for the FB sticks at all. Liked them at first, but on extended play, the flaws are obvious. The original plastic actuator on the CX40 stick (by design) has *some* give to it and coupled with the dome design, is always going to feel superior to the repro's and the FB sticks of today IMO. And with the way the actuator wears (the whiter the corners/stress on the plastic, the more give they have), some sticks will exhibit more mushiness or a longer throw than others. A few different variables to observe here for sure! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CX40_Plus Posted August 8, 2016 Author Share Posted August 8, 2016 Might actually *want* to file down the nub/nipple off the actuator, huh? Don't want too great a throw either, but that nipple filed down might just be the ticket to feeling as "natural" as possible for such a mod? That's very possible. To me the stick feels significantly better, as you get much more immediate feedback and less wiggle, but it's certainly not the classic CX40 feel. It would be great to get some other people play and feedback once I have my next revision. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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