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Goochman

New Atari Console that Ataribox?

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Sure, your life can change quickly but unless you have a reasonable buffer, you probably shouldn't put down ~$300 on a video game that may arrive in a year. If he has preordered one of the bundles no longer available or which was hiked up in price, perhaps he can sell the rights for what he preordered to some late coming customer.

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If that person is telling the truth about hard times that sucks.

 

 

no it doesn't, if they were not shelling out 300 bucks to any dipshit on the interweb promising to sell them magic beans somefucking time next year ... guess what? Maybe times wouldnt be so hard.

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What do you mean, 'wishful thinking?' I thought the controller was the only thing that actually works, was I wrong or did I miss something?

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What do you mean, 'wishful thinking?' I thought the controller was the only thing that actually works, was I wrong or did I miss something?

I'm assuming the wishful thinking part refers to it functioning as a paddle too.

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no it doesn't, if they were not shelling out 300 bucks to any dipshit on the interweb promising to sell them magic beans somefucking time next year ... guess what? Maybe times wouldnt be so hard.

Can't find way to embed for some reason so I attached instead.

post-13851-0-52871000-1532874361.gif

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On one hand I can empathize with Hardship Carlos as in my youth I don't think there wasn't a lesson I didn't learn the hard way; including impulse spending without a cushion. On the other hand, "no refunds" was one fact actually put out there fairly early. Granted, it may have only been in the comments section (?) but one should assume as much when contributing to a crowdfunding campaign.

 

http://www.isitdownrightnow.com/atari.com.html

 

Maybe they're performing maintenance? Though it's still business hours in Paris. Maybe Tin Giant has taken over their website duties.

 

It says it's been down for more than a week. :-o

As I wrote before, it's long been a cruddy website with slow load times or 404 errors. I'd periodically check the site for English news releases. But this is pretty ridiculous. Just imagine this kind of care and love if Internet connection is required for AtariOS games.

Not a peep about it on Atari's Twitter or Facebook accounts, because they ❤loooove❤ their fans.

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Just found out what happened. Due to budget constraints, Rob Wyatt had to swipe the web server computer when setting up his office.

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Atari.com could be restructuring to be VCS focused

 

Perhaps they are completely updating their branding

Edited by AlecRob
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Hey everyone! This is my first post here and glad to be around; I've been following the thread since the VCS reveal last year and it's been my go-to for info and opinions regarding that project. I did see some Sega talk earlier and I'm more a Sega fan than an Atari one (didn't grow up w/ them as they were a bit before my time), so while I feel I kinda have to interject on a few things there, it's mainly b/c it ties into my own opinion of the VCS and why it has such a massive image/trust problem that won't go away anytime soon.

 

I think we can all agree that the Sega of today isn't the same Sega from back in the console days, that much is clear. It isn't the same company that was at the forefront of 3D graphics tech in arcades beyond what you could get at the home or on computers of the time, and it isn't the same company that published ridiculous-yet-funny stuff like Sea-Man and Segagaga!. Nor is it the same company that dove into somewhat oddball-yet-interesting multimedia pushes with their home consoles (getting other companies like Hitachi and JVC to manufacture versions of systems, adding video playback and karaoke features, pushing online gaming and web browsing before those things became mainstream w/ gaming consoles etc.). I get that much.

 

It's also not a stretch to say that their exit from the console market was more or less their own doing. I'm not one of the guys in the camp that feels the Sega CD did any actual damage to the brand at the time, but releasing things like the 32X (which should have been completely cancelled) and the surprise Saturn launch did them no favors. We can argue as to the how and why into those decisions, or if it was SoA or SoJ who pushed for them, but that doesn't matter in this context. Sega as a company, like Atari, simply made too many mistakes with consumers as a platform holder in too small a span of time to justify holding a spot as a platform holder in the eyes of most gamers. By the early 2000s, their time was up in that game, and things just came to be as they are now. Even if some of us would have preferred differently, a lot of that preference has come with hindsight, and and things shape out the way they do for a reason.

 

That said, I *do* think there's misconceptions surrounding Sega in their post-console years. While the Sonic series has been, at best, serviceable (with some true horror stories and a few quite good games in-between, the latter recently being Mania)...it has been consistent. And they've certainly put out more than a small handful of good games you can count on one hand, too. Off the top of my head (and not to turn this into a list war, but merely illustrating a point), you have: Virtua Fighter 4 (and EVO), GunValkyrie, Outrun 2, Billy Hatcher, Super Monkey Ball, Virtua Fighter 5 (and FS), Valkyrie Profile, Sonic Colors, Sonic Generations, the Yakuza series, Afterburner: Climax, Sega Rally 3/Sega Rally Revo, Jet Set Radio Future, House of the Dead 3 and 4, Sonic All-Stars Racing Transformed, Virtual-On Oratorio Tangram, Virtua Tennis 4 and more recently some stuff like A Certain Magical Virtual-On, 7th Dragon III, House of the Dead: Scarlet Dawn and Sega World Drivers Championship. And in terms of games they've published, you have the Platinum-developed Bayonetta and Vanquish, the Total War games, Alien Isolation, Football Manager series etc. And there's more I could name but feel that's enough.

 

The reason I did that wasn't just to discount the idea they've barely put out any decent software since going third-party, but also that they've been consistent in publishing in a meaningful way since leaving the hardware business. Sure, a lot of particular games I'd like to see aren't there, but I can't hold that against the quality and quantity of otherwise solid releases from them. And while they did make some (obviously) dumb decisions when going third-party (imo splitting their base across all three systems 6th gen was a mistake, they should've mainly focused on PS2), again,...at least they have been consistent. More than that, really. And doing this has helped them both retain a relationship with most of the old fans, and ALSO bring in new fans....the majority of whom I can promise are not utterly insane and/or want a Dreamcast 2 in any serious way ;)

 

That's ultimately what it boils down to tying this into Atari and the VCS; even if, in the off-chance (and completely insane) decision Sega were ever to jump back into making consoles...imho, I feel they would have "earned" the opportunity much, much more than Atari has. Because ever since leaving the hardware market, Atari's publishing track record has been spotty, and in some cases, completely dead. I remember when they were publishing some games in the 6th gen, particularly Enter The Matrix...which was a completely broken game, but still relevant. They published a small handful of other games, too, but the last MAJOR release I can think of from them was 2008's Alone in the Dark. After that things just...kind of...petered out.

 

Atari's gone under multiple restructurings I'm sure, so hopefully people keep in mind that I'm just referring to "Atari" in general and not any specific incarnation. That said, aside from those mentioned games, Atari's presence in the mainstream gaming circle has been more or less a marginal one. Yes, they have had the clone system deal w/ ATGames and a few Flashback collections, but when I mention the "mainstream" gaming circle and building rapport, that's mainly in relation to new software (either w/ new IP or current/legacy IP) targeted at old and new fans on the major mainstream consoles, and that's something that, undeniably, Sega has done significantly more of (and better) than Atari since they both went third-party.

 

It's what leads to my main issue w/ this new VCS, honestly: it feels like an unearned shot at the big boy's table, from a company that has very little to any rapport with current mainstream gaming audiences, and hasn't made success of chances to bring in a large enough stable of new fans to their brand, so they're mainly banking off of nostalgia from the older hardcore fans, which in Atari's case, isn't enough to sustain a console. Not one as a major competitor, hell not even one at the Ouya's level honestly. If it seems like they're having trouble getting notable developers on board, that's probably because they have little to no clout with the modern industry in which those developers are a part of, so why should they bother to develop on a system that, compared to PS4, XBO or Switch, is a non-starter? All the same, why would brick-and-mortar stores bother to stock the system and take away shelf-space from those other consoles, or the much-cheaper Flashbacks?

 

When you really think about it, what market niche does the VCS even serve? It's price puts it in league with a PS4, XBO, or Switch, all of which offer a much richer ecosystem of 1st and 3rd party gaming content and multimedia apps, and are either much more powerful for a few dollars more, or offer a level of lifestyle convenience something like the VCS never could. It's priced well beyond things like the Dreamcade Replay, which can do almost all of the emulation the VCS will, for a cheaper price, and from a company with a track record of proven hardware (via their MAME arcade systems). It's also priced well beyond simple streaming boxes that can play all sorts of media content in hi-def 4K with ample options and home theater integration, so why get a VCS for simply that? And for those just wanting a nostalgic rush of an experience, I'm certain they can get one of those clone retro emulator systems out there for $100-$150 that even let them use their original cartridges to play from, a feature the VCS completely lacks. Oh but what about those who'd want to mess around in that sandbox environment they're promising? Well, I'm certain they can do that already on their own PCs, or if they really want to try some cool hobby projects, just get a RasPI kit on the cheap and dig in.

 

To be completely fair, these same factors of niche-filling would apply if this were Sega making a Dreamcast 2, or SNK making a Neo-Geo 2 or whatever. The fact of the matter is, the home gaming market is already being well-served by Sony, Microsoft, Nintendo, PC and mobile, so unless a company has some wildly inventive stuff to throw into the ring (and the capital to do so), there's no reason for them to try as the industry marches towards what could be the last console generation anyhow. Leave that to companies like Google, Apple, and Samsung. SegaSammy should stick to what they're doing now, including third-party software support for the Big 3. Making a Dreamcast 2 to compete against them would be financial suicide. Same for SNK. Honestly, I feel the one area any of these companies should try to do more in could be arcades; aside from a small handful of companies like Raw Thrills, Sega, and BandaiNamco, the scene's pretty underserved. Hell, even with them it's underserved and could be waiting for a blossoming, much the way Nintendo helped get the American home console market back to life w/ NES. But that's an entirely different conversation.

 

Atari, with this new VCS, just feels like they're blinded with nostalgic ignorance, or worst yet, arrogance. To think that even without building rapport in the largest chunks of the industry (significant rapport, anyway), without truly strengthening ties w/ old fans or bringing in new fans gradually, they can just try to go up against companies that have been doing these very same things for decades, is complete insanity. You can see the arrogance shine through too in how they handled some things like the social media, and attacking certain reporters and Youtubers in pretty unprofessional ways. And that's really the biggest reason I feel this project is going to fail, because I haven't gotten a single tinge from them showing that they've learned or grown from the end of Jaguar to now. At least Jaguar-era Atari was commendable for trying some actual engineering and having a hilarious ad campaign that backfired horribly, but at the very least, seemed interesting (speaking as a guy who at the time didn't even know who Atari *was*; like said earlier, they were before my time :/). The current Atari definitely has the 2nd part locked down but with none of the earnestness and sincerity (or engineering talent, even if the end product is buggy) of the last true vintages of the company.

 

I'll keep hoping they announce something that surprises, shows that they're taking this seriously...you know, maybe by announcing some GAMES. If they want to position this as a legit console effort, they should know that it won't get anywhere without some 1st party content that isn't available anywhere else. But as I already basically said earlier, they haven't even bothered with much consistency of quality software for systems on the market after going third-party, so what hope is there that they'll step up those efforts for a system with magnitudes smaller a potential install base, even in the best-case scenario? There is none.

 

Again, glad to be able to post and share my thoughts up here, hope to have more to share in the future whenever they reveal something meaningful on this project. I wish Atari the best of luck w/ this VCS because they will need ALL of it and more, just to stand a chance.

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If your point is that Sega has more credibility in trying to put a console to market than Atari, it's a small point but I would agree to it. Neither company should be trying it, except in "Flashback" capacity, however. That's where I think Atari screwed up... they got greedy and insisted on something that would cost $300 a pop. If they had designed a Flashback with console features, the Ataribox would have been much more attractive to buyers and viable in the marketplace.

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If your point is that Sega has more credibility in trying to put a console to market than Atari, it's a small point but I would agree to it. Neither company should be trying it, except in "Flashback" capacity, however. That's where I think Atari screwed up... they got greedy and insisted on something that would cost $300 a pop. If they had designed a Flashback with console features, the Ataribox would have been much more attractive to buyers and viable in the marketplace.

 

Yes, that's essentially the point of it, but also to show that the credibility comes with consistency and building rapport w/ the community (fans, gamers in general, developers and publishers, etc.). And you're right: in the grand scheme of it, it's a small point, but in directly comparing the two it's a much wider discrepancy between one who's mostly been doing it right, and one who's mostly been doing it wrong.

 

I'm also in the idea that something like this could've worked as an enthusiast type of system priced reasonably. As you said, a Flashback kind of thing but w/ a few more extensive console features, kind of mirroring what's in systems now but more focused on the games and not multimedia things. They wouldn't even have needed to make it exclusively as a Flashback device; give an option w/ that stuff in the Flashback digital collections for other platforms, the convenience of a hardware version would just be for the hardcore fans that want to play that stuff on something resembling the original hardware.

 

Atari does deserve some credit for the Flashbacks being more or less on-point though, which is more than can be said about most of the Genesis systems from ATGames. Hopefully they've gone back to the drawing board on that recent one they revealed. Though really the one I'm most looking forward to atm is the Neo-Geo mini....as long as it's priced reasonably.

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Atari does deserve some credit for the Flashbacks being more or less on-point though, which is more than can be said about most of the Genesis systems from ATGames. Hopefully they've gone back to the drawing board on that recent one they revealed. Though really the one I'm most looking forward to atm is the Neo-Geo mini....as long as it's priced reasonably.

 

AtGames makes the Atari Flashback series as well.

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AtGames makes the Atari Flashback series as well.

 

Ah yeah, had meant to mention that xD. For whatever reason the 2600 ones have been more accurate than the Genesis ones. Might come down to components being used, lack of effort etc. I dunno :/

 

Wouldn't mind an "all-in-one" Flashback-like system for either of them tho; 2600, 5200, the computers etc. w/ Atari. Genesis, Saturn, Dreamcast, arcade games etc. w/ Sega. Just bring all the product lines together under one product and take it from there.

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I'd think the relative merits of AtGames's devices are pretty much down to the quality of the software emulation. The Atari ones do an accurate enough job, while the Sega ones are somewhat less than the state of the art to put it mildly. Sadly, they've known of the deficiencies of the emulation for many years yet certain features stay broken while entirely new ones get added, so I wouldn't hold up much hope of them being fixed in the next iteration either. You can at least buy some rather better compilations of Sega games for the PC and most consoles though.

 

So far as a combined system goes, it'd be a doddle technically as they're basically just different software emulators running on almost exactly the same hardware. However, it'd break all common sense so far as a branding exercise goes. Let's face it; these things are as much meant to sit on the TV cabinet as an objet d'art as they are to be used for actually playing games and the look is a big part of their appeal so they really have to be identifiable as one system or the other.

 

As for where the VCS sits in all this, I'd think that Atari must have realized rather early on that they can't just create another device in the same price range, as that'd just compete with the AtGames devices. Therefore the price had to be significantly higher with more offered, and the only thing they've got that they possibly could offer is their collection of PC games. After that though, it's just been a descent into wild fantasy or, if you'd prefer, "wishful thinking."

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I'd think the relative merits of AtGames's devices are pretty much down to the quality of the software emulation. The Atari ones do an accurate enough job, while the Sega ones are somewhat less than the state of the art to put it mildly. Sadly, they've known of the deficiencies of the emulation for many years yet certain features stay broken while entirely new ones get added, so I wouldn't hold up much hope of them being fixed in the next iteration either. You can at least buy some rather better compilations of Sega games for the PC and most consoles though.

 

So far as a combined system goes, it'd be a doddle technically as they're basically just different software emulators running on almost exactly the same hardware. However, it'd break all common sense so far as a branding exercise goes. Let's face it; these things are as much meant to sit on the TV cabinet as an objet d'art as they are to be used for actually playing games and the look is a big part of their appeal so they really have to be identifiable as one system or the other.

 

As for where the VCS sits in all this, I'd think that Atari must have realized rather early on that they can't just create another device in the same price range, as that'd just compete with the AtGames devices. Therefore the price had to be significantly higher with more offered, and the only thing they've got that they possibly could offer is their collection of PC games. After that though, it's just been a descent into wild fantasy or, if you'd prefer, "wishful thinking."

 

Regarding the combination system, you're right, the look and feel of having a physical replica under the tv is a HUGE part of it, but I still think it could both work and likely make for an easier sell. All they'd need to do is make shell variants, so the stuff inside's the same, but the exterior would be whatever system a person'd prefer. An Atari version'd likely be easier, save maybe for Jaguar (don't know how good Jag emulation is these days) , not just for technical reasons but the games on average would be smaller. Vs. something trying to include Saturn and Dreamcast images in there, just one of those can eat away a few hundred megabytes, so they'd prob need a nice, fat microSD or small and "cheap" SSD, both kinda costly tho.

 

VCS-wise, maybe they could throw in their arcade games as well? Even the ones up into the '90s. They could even pull a Nintendo and finish development on some prototypes to release in there like w/ Starfox 2, but that'd mean either having internal game devs (doubt they have any) or getting someone like Llamasoft to do the honors.

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Regarding the combination system, you're right, the look and feel of having a physical replica under the tv is a HUGE part of it, but I still think it could both work and likely make for an easier sell. All they'd need to do is make shell variants, so the stuff inside's the same, but the exterior would be whatever system a person'd prefer. An Atari version'd likely be easier, save maybe for Jaguar (don't know how good Jag emulation is these days) , not just for technical reasons but the games on average would be smaller. Vs. something trying to include Saturn and Dreamcast images in there, just one of those can eat away a few hundred megabytes, so they'd prob need a nice, fat microSD or small and "cheap" SSD, both kinda costly tho.

 

VCS-wise, maybe they could throw in their arcade games as well? Even the ones up into the '90s. They could even pull a Nintendo and finish development on some prototypes to release in there like w/ Starfox 2, but that'd mean either having internal game devs (doubt they have any) or getting someone like Llamasoft to do the honors.

 

It's pretty much already the case that the internals of all these devices are nearly identical in that they're all done with an ARM SoC and some ROM and RAM on a board. You'd need a more powerful SoC for more modern systems - such as the Dreamcast - and the cost of the ROM would also increase if you want a large game collection. Emulation is far from perfect for the more modern systems, but this can be worked around by carefully curating the content to avoid any game-breaking issues; most of the games that don't work at all tend to be obscure ones that'd be of little interest to most people buying a plug-n-play device anyway. Demand is also a big issue though; Sega only really hit the big time with the Genesis/Megadrive and Atari with the 2600; their other systems would be a nice cherry on top for the few who actually know what they are, but for most they're pretty obscure.

 

The VCS is already promised the arcade games that are a part of Atari Vault, so it should have that over the Flashback. However, I doubt they're that compelling for most people and you could have picked up Vault itself for a shade over $3 in the recent Steam sale, so they need to be offering much more. And yes, they've not got any development teams in house, they only manage the licensing of the IP. Most of the studios they work with, Llamasoft included, are pretty small with numbers of development staff you can count on one hand and don't even work exclusively with Atari.

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Sega really should buy atari. And SNK.

Sega would be wise to avoid that dumpster fire. They are Japanese anyway. Same logic applies to Coleco as well. Aside from Mcrosoft, all the US companies that ever entered the console race have crashed and burned. At least Sega is still making games, LOL!

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Hey everyone! This is my first post here and glad to be around; I've been following the thread since the VCS reveal last year and it's been my go-to for info and opinions regarding that project. I did see some Sega talk earlier and I'm more a Sega fan than an Atari one (didn't grow up w/ them as they were a bit before my time), so while I feel I kinda have to interject on a few things there, it's mainly b/c it ties into my own opinion of the VCS and why it has such a massive image/trust problem that won't go away anytime soon.

 

I think we can all agree that the Sega of today isn't the same Sega from back in the console days, that much is clear. It isn't the same company that was at the forefront of 3D graphics tech in arcades beyond what you could get at the home or on computers of the time, and it isn't the same company that published ridiculous-yet-funny stuff like Sea-Man and Segagaga!. Nor is it the same company that dove into somewhat oddball-yet-interesting multimedia pushes with their home consoles (getting other companies like Hitachi and JVC to manufacture versions of systems, adding video playback and karaoke features, pushing online gaming and web browsing before those things became mainstream w/ gaming consoles etc.). I get that much.

 

It's also not a stretch to say that their exit from the console market was more or less their own doing. I'm not one of the guys in the camp that feels the Sega CD did any actual damage to the brand at the time, but releasing things like the 32X (which should have been completely cancelled) and the surprise Saturn launch did them no favors. We can argue as to the how and why into those decisions, or if it was SoA or SoJ who pushed for them, but that doesn't matter in this context. Sega as a company, like Atari, simply made too many mistakes with consumers as a platform holder in too small a span of time to justify holding a spot as a platform holder in the eyes of most gamers. By the early 2000s, their time was up in that game, and things just came to be as they are now. Even if some of us would have preferred differently, a lot of that preference has come with hindsight, and and things shape out the way they do for a reason.

 

That said, I *do* think there's misconceptions surrounding Sega in their post-console years. While the Sonic series has been, at best, serviceable (with some true horror stories and a few quite good games in-between, the latter recently being Mania)...it has been consistent. And they've certainly put out more than a small handful of good games you can count on one hand, too. Off the top of my head (and not to turn this into a list war, but merely illustrating a point), you have: Virtua Fighter 4 (and EVO), GunValkyrie, Outrun 2, Billy Hatcher, Super Monkey Ball, Virtua Fighter 5 (and FS), Valkyrie Profile, Sonic Colors, Sonic Generations, the Yakuza series, Afterburner: Climax, Sega Rally 3/Sega Rally Revo, Jet Set Radio Future, House of the Dead 3 and 4, Sonic All-Stars Racing Transformed, Virtual-On Oratorio Tangram, Virtua Tennis 4 and more recently some stuff like A Certain Magical Virtual-On, 7th Dragon III, House of the Dead: Scarlet Dawn and Sega World Drivers Championship. And in terms of games they've published, you have the Platinum-developed Bayonetta and Vanquish, the Total War games, Alien Isolation, Football Manager series etc. And there's more I could name but feel that's enough.

 

The reason I did that wasn't just to discount the idea they've barely put out any decent software since going third-party, but also that they've been consistent in publishing in a meaningful way since leaving the hardware business. Sure, a lot of particular games I'd like to see aren't there, but I can't hold that against the quality and quantity of otherwise solid releases from them. And while they did make some (obviously) dumb decisions when going third-party (imo splitting their base across all three systems 6th gen was a mistake, they should've mainly focused on PS2), again,...at least they have been consistent. More than that, really. And doing this has helped them both retain a relationship with most of the old fans, and ALSO bring in new fans....the majority of whom I can promise are not utterly insane and/or want a Dreamcast 2 in any serious way ;)

 

That's ultimately what it boils down to tying this into Atari and the VCS; even if, in the off-chance (and completely insane) decision Sega were ever to jump back into making consoles...imho, I feel they would have "earned" the opportunity much, much more than Atari has. Because ever since leaving the hardware market, Atari's publishing track record has been spotty, and in some cases, completely dead. I remember when they were publishing some games in the 6th gen, particularly Enter The Matrix...which was a completely broken game, but still relevant. They published a small handful of other games, too, but the last MAJOR release I can think of from them was 2008's Alone in the Dark. After that things just...kind of...petered out.

 

Atari's gone under multiple restructurings I'm sure, so hopefully people keep in mind that I'm just referring to "Atari" in general and not any specific incarnation. That said, aside from those mentioned games, Atari's presence in the mainstream gaming circle has been more or less a marginal one. Yes, they have had the clone system deal w/ ATGames and a few Flashback collections, but when I mention the "mainstream" gaming circle and building rapport, that's mainly in relation to new software (either w/ new IP or current/legacy IP) targeted at old and new fans on the major mainstream consoles, and that's something that, undeniably, Sega has done significantly more of (and better) than Atari since they both went third-party.

 

It's what leads to my main issue w/ this new VCS, honestly: it feels like an unearned shot at the big boy's table, from a company that has very little to any rapport with current mainstream gaming audiences, and hasn't made success of chances to bring in a large enough stable of new fans to their brand, so they're mainly banking off of nostalgia from the older hardcore fans, which in Atari's case, isn't enough to sustain a console. Not one as a major competitor, hell not even one at the Ouya's level honestly. If it seems like they're having trouble getting notable developers on board, that's probably because they have little to no clout with the modern industry in which those developers are a part of, so why should they bother to develop on a system that, compared to PS4, XBO or Switch, is a non-starter? All the same, why would brick-and-mortar stores bother to stock the system and take away shelf-space from those other consoles, or the much-cheaper Flashbacks?

 

When you really think about it, what market niche does the VCS even serve? It's price puts it in league with a PS4, XBO, or Switch, all of which offer a much richer ecosystem of 1st and 3rd party gaming content and multimedia apps, and are either much more powerful for a few dollars more, or offer a level of lifestyle convenience something like the VCS never could. It's priced well beyond things like the Dreamcade Replay, which can do almost all of the emulation the VCS will, for a cheaper price, and from a company with a track record of proven hardware (via their MAME arcade systems). It's also priced well beyond simple streaming boxes that can play all sorts of media content in hi-def 4K with ample options and home theater integration, so why get a VCS for simply that? And for those just wanting a nostalgic rush of an experience, I'm certain they can get one of those clone retro emulator systems out there for $100-$150 that even let them use their original cartridges to play from, a feature the VCS completely lacks. Oh but what about those who'd want to mess around in that sandbox environment they're promising? Well, I'm certain they can do that already on their own PCs, or if they really want to try some cool hobby projects, just get a RasPI kit on the cheap and dig in.

 

To be completely fair, these same factors of niche-filling would apply if this were Sega making a Dreamcast 2, or SNK making a Neo-Geo 2 or whatever. The fact of the matter is, the home gaming market is already being well-served by Sony, Microsoft, Nintendo, PC and mobile, so unless a company has some wildly inventive stuff to throw into the ring (and the capital to do so), there's no reason for them to try as the industry marches towards what could be the last console generation anyhow. Leave that to companies like Google, Apple, and Samsung. SegaSammy should stick to what they're doing now, including third-party software support for the Big 3. Making a Dreamcast 2 to compete against them would be financial suicide. Same for SNK. Honestly, I feel the one area any of these companies should try to do more in could be arcades; aside from a small handful of companies like Raw Thrills, Sega, and BandaiNamco, the scene's pretty underserved. Hell, even with them it's underserved and could be waiting for a blossoming, much the way Nintendo helped get the American home console market back to life w/ NES. But that's an entirely different conversation.

 

Atari, with this new VCS, just feels like they're blinded with nostalgic ignorance, or worst yet, arrogance. To think that even without building rapport in the largest chunks of the industry (significant rapport, anyway), without truly strengthening ties w/ old fans or bringing in new fans gradually, they can just try to go up against companies that have been doing these very same things for decades, is complete insanity. You can see the arrogance shine through too in how they handled some things like the social media, and attacking certain reporters and Youtubers in pretty unprofessional ways. And that's really the biggest reason I feel this project is going to fail, because I haven't gotten a single tinge from them showing that they've learned or grown from the end of Jaguar to now. At least Jaguar-era Atari was commendable for trying some actual engineering and having a hilarious ad campaign that backfired horribly, but at the very least, seemed interesting (speaking as a guy who at the time didn't even know who Atari *was*; like said earlier, they were before my time :/). The current Atari definitely has the 2nd part locked down but with none of the earnestness and sincerity (or engineering talent, even if the end product is buggy) of the last true vintages of the company.

 

I'll keep hoping they announce something that surprises, shows that they're taking this seriously...you know, maybe by announcing some GAMES. If they want to position this as a legit console effort, they should know that it won't get anywhere without some 1st party content that isn't available anywhere else. But as I already basically said earlier, they haven't even bothered with much consistency of quality software for systems on the market after going third-party, so what hope is there that they'll step up those efforts for a system with magnitudes smaller a potential install base, even in the best-case scenario? There is none.

 

Again, glad to be able to post and share my thoughts up here, hope to have more to share in the future whenever they reveal something meaningful on this project. I wish Atari the best of luck w/ this VCS because they will need ALL of it and more, just to stand a chance.

 

You make a really good point here dude.

 

I've grown to accept the reality that Sega's never going to make another console again, but I believe that if Sega were to actually do that, it would have a WAY better chance of being something more successful than the Atari VCS. When I browse around and watch various videos about Sega and their previous consoles on YouTube, I actually see a good number of people in the comments section that *still* want them to come back with a new console, and it's pretty amazing. Sega could do it better than Atari for sure.

 

When I first heard about the Atari VCS (or the "Ataribox"), I was like, "wait.... what?? O.o" It was so puzzling to me, because as far as I knew, Atari wasn't even a company anymore, let alone one that could release a new game console. XDDD Like I've been saying before in this thread, as much as I have fondness towards Atari, I actually really wish this was SEGA doing the console instead of Atari... ;w;

 

While I doubt Sega will ever make a new console again, one thing I think Sega could potentially get away with is maybe producing a limited-run HTPC for those die-hard fans that are clamoring for new Sega hardware..... Recently Sega has actually tapped their foot in the water with the crowdfunding concept. Yeah, it was just a Sonic toaster XDDD But maybe since that was actually successful it could lead to bigger crowdfunding projects for them in the future...… Baby steps is the way to go here, but I think Sega would maybe consider distributing a Windows 10-based "console" of sorts that can play Steam games, it would come shipped with one controller, and it would come pre-loaded with a bunch of Sega classics, etc. They could do something like that without it being a legitimate console. I think that would win over a lot of fans.

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It's pretty much already the case that the internals of all these devices are nearly identical in that they're all done with an ARM SoC and some ROM and RAM on a board. You'd need a more powerful SoC for more modern systems - such as the Dreamcast - and the cost of the ROM would also increase if you want a large game collection. Emulation is far from perfect for the more modern systems, but this can be worked around by carefully curating the content to avoid any game-breaking issues; most of the games that don't work at all tend to be obscure ones that'd be of little interest to most people buying a plug-n-play device anyway. Demand is also a big issue though; Sega only really hit the big time with the Genesis/Megadrive and Atari with the 2600; their other systems would be a nice cherry on top for the few who actually know what they are, but for most they're pretty obscure.

 

The VCS is already promised the arcade games that are a part of Atari Vault, so it should have that over the Flashback. However, I doubt they're that compelling for most people and you could have picked up Vault itself for a shade over $3 in the recent Steam sale, so they need to be offering much more. And yes, they've not got any development teams in house, they only manage the licensing of the IP. Most of the studios they work with, Llamasoft included, are pretty small with numbers of development staff you can count on one hand and don't even work exclusively with Atari.

 

The other systems from them both are more obscure for sure compared to how widespread names like PlayStation and NES are globally, I agree, but I'm usually pretty surprised with how much positive WOM Dreamcast gets online. It may be mostly related to gaming circles, but I often see lots of YT vids for example that are generally very positive on it, and some of those getting up to hundreds of thousands (a few even millions) of views and lots of comment engagement. There seems to be a whole generation of younger people getting into that system, and kind of seems like the same's happening with Saturn, albiet not quite the same degree (for starters, collecting for it is a pain in the ass).

 

Atari-wise I don't see a lot of that same spread but impressions from some w/ the Jaguar seems to have gotten more positive in recent years. I don't seem to see their computer line being dogged the same way as the non-2600 console side, but I'd assume the reach there is limited. I agree tho they need to do something software-wise to make VCS more appealing; they don't have a lot of options but teams like Llamasoft might be their best bet.

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You make a really good point here dude.

 

I've grown to accept the reality that Sega's never going to make another console again, but I believe that if Sega were to actually do that, it would have a WAY better chance of being something more successful than the Atari VCS. When I browse around and watch various videos about Sega and their previous consoles on YouTube, I actually see a good number of people in the comments section that *still* want them to come back with a new console, and it's pretty amazing. Sega could do it better than Atari for sure.

 

When I first heard about the Atari VCS (or the "Ataribox"), I was like, "wait.... what?? O.o" It was so puzzling to me, because as far as I knew, Atari wasn't even a company anymore, let alone one that could release a new game console. XDDD Like I've been saying before in this thread, as much as I have fondness towards Atari, I actually really wish this was SEGA doing the console instead of Atari... ;w;

 

While I doubt Sega will ever make a new console again, one thing I think Sega could potentially get away with is maybe producing a limited-run HTPC for those die-hard fans that are clamoring for new Sega hardware..... Recently Sega has actually tapped their foot in the water with the crowdfunding concept. Yeah, it was just a Sonic toaster XDDD But maybe since that was actually successful it could lead to bigger crowdfunding projects for them in the future...… Baby steps is the way to go here, but I think Sega would maybe consider distributing a Windows 10-based "console" of sorts that can play Steam games, it would come shipped with one controller, and it would come pre-loaded with a bunch of Sega classics, etc. They could do something like that without it being a legitimate console. I think that would win over a lot of fans.

 

 

Yeah, that Sega HTPC idea sounds pretty neat actually. Since it wouldn't be marketed as a console, it wouldn't bring any of the expectations people generally have w/ consoles like "Where's the 1st party content?", "How good are the graphics?", etc. Just make a solid box OEM-style, put Windows 10 on there, maybe work out some terms w/ different emulator devs (or better yet, since M2 I think is doing the Sega Ages collection on Switch, hire them for emulation purposes) and load it with games. Most importantly tho, give it a console-like aesthetic, a variety of them, innards stay the same but the exterior ranging from different systems. Maybe even add an actual cart slot on the MegaDrive/Genesis versions to play actual carts. But they'd HAVE to have the arcade games on board, too, and not just the usual picks.

 

My only caveat there is that, technically, HTPCs aren't that upgradable. Stuff like RAM are usually locked in place, so if they could make components like that user-upgradable it'd be neat. To be perfectly honest, the more I've learned on Atari the more I feel a HTPC-like approach would've done a lot better. Just position as that instead of a gaming console, market the computer side more. Maybe a custom GUI suite emulating their classic computer OSes in visual style, but with modern user comforts. There's probably the issue of marketability b/c 2600 is just so ubiquitous w/ the company's image it seems, but seeing as how the VCS is already virtually a HTPC, marketing it as a HTPC would have saved them a lot of the social media headaches they've gone through, especially if they chose to model the design after one of their computers instead of the VCS (or have that and the VCS as model options differing in looks only).

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Better late than never, I think I finally figured out how to pronounce Chesnais:

 

post-12607-0-01194100-1532922634_thumb.jpg

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isnt sega the one that gave us a softcore porn backstory tween a hedgehog and a teenage girl, or was it the nude sarah palin devel may cry rip-off half a decade late

 

yea that's a great caretaker of a brand ... who couldn't even give us a proper next gen sonic game for 20 years or so (like its that fucking hard, go fast sideways and drop the shitty ass j-pop)

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The other systems from them both are more obscure for sure compared to how widespread names like PlayStation and NES are globally, I agree, but I'm usually pretty surprised with how much positive WOM Dreamcast gets online. It may be mostly related to gaming circles, but I often see lots of YT vids for example that are generally very positive on it, and some of those getting up to hundreds of thousands (a few even millions) of views and lots of comment engagement. There seems to be a whole generation of younger people getting into that system, and kind of seems like the same's happening with Saturn, albiet not quite the same degree (for starters, collecting for it is a pain in the ass).

 

Atari-wise I don't see a lot of that same spread but impressions from some w/ the Jaguar seems to have gotten more positive in recent years. I don't seem to see their computer line being dogged the same way as the non-2600 console side, but I'd assume the reach there is limited. I agree tho they need to do something software-wise to make VCS more appealing; they don't have a lot of options but teams like Llamasoft might be their best bet.

 

I'd think that the Dreamcast appeals to people for a lot of different reasons, not all of which make it marketable. It's certainly got some great games, coincided with the last gasp of arcade gaming, was notable for some highly innovative features, and is one of the most powerful systems that can be emulated well. However, Sega ultimately didn't sell that many of them and it had a commercial lifetime of just a couple of years. For every fan who waxes lyrical about it, there are going to be several more who still felt that they got burned because they bought it only to see the supply of games dry up very quickly. Neither is wrong as far as I'm concerned, as both viewpoints have their merits, but only one is going to be interested in buying a relaunched version.

 

So far as Atari's home computers go, they fit somewhere in between the massively successful 2600 and the other consoles, which would all generally be regarded as failures. However, making a plug-n-play system for either the 8-bits or the ST is going to have all the problems of the C64 that we've discussed before, in addition to not being nearly as successful as it. Most of the memorable games were made by third parties, and a substantial proportion of the userbase will be looking to use a keyboard, dust off their programming skills and/or run some non-games software on them. You could perhaps compare it with the various attempts to get various modern versions of the ZX Spectrum to market, some of which were more successful than others, but all were rather niche with total sales in the thousands. Enterprising hobbyists could perhaps cater to that better than a large corporation too.

 

It's hard to tell where the Atari-Llamasoft partnership will go from here. Jeff Minter is obviously a big fan of many old Atari games, so it'd be nice to see him giving others that he's already riffed on numerous times - such as Asteroids, Caverns of Mars and Centipede - the 4000 treatment. However, at the same time, relations were obviously strained by the legal wrangling over TxK so maybe he'll prefer to end things there. Either way, I don't see enough games coming that way to sell much in the way of VCS hardware, especially if they're also going to be available on other platforms. And they're going to have to be if he wants to earn more than pocket change out of it.

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