Question about missing 50Hz-fullscreenmode in newest Stella version

[AW127]

Any news about this point here? About half a year ago there was written, that it needs more discussion

https://github.com/stella-emu/stella/issues/285

 

The discussion there goes deeper and deeper in technical details about vsync, emulation-loops, perfect audio and so on. But the only thing i wanted is a simple function in STELLA, that two different screen-resolutions will be used for PAL and NTSC roms, not more.

 

EVERYTHING ELSE, the user can configure in it's own Windows (or whatever operating-system is used). The user can set THERE specific Hz-values to specific screen-resolutions and thats it. STELLA should only use two different screen-resolutions for PAL and NTSC roms. That's all, no need for changing anything else. I see it here on my PC. At the moment, STELLA uses exactly this screen-resolution and Hz-value, which the user has set as his standard Windows screen-resolution. In my case this is 1280x1024 with 60Hz. My STELLA fullscreen then also uses exactly these values. Perfect for NTSC games which runs with 60 frames per second. Not perfect for PAL games with their 50 frames per second.

 

When i then simply change my Windows standard-resolution to 1280x1024 with 50Hz (this Hz-value is no problem for my monitor) and start STELLA, then PAL games runs absolutely perfect smooth, but NTSC games not. Same problem vice versa. But PAL games works perfect then in this mode, no changing needed in vsyncing, emulation-loops and all of that. When the Hz-value fits the frames-per-second-value everything is fine here on my PC and also on the PC's from my friends where i also tested this.

 

If it is such a big problem to let newer versions of STELLA automatically use different screen-resolutions for NTSC and PAL roms (which worked in old STELLA versions and was discussed here alot above) then why not make a new function in STELLA menue, which allows the user to change the screen-resolution manually directly in the emulator? The user then can, before he plays a PAL rom for example, switch to this resolution, for which he had set a 50Hz value before (in his Windows). Then the user don't need to leave STELLA all the time and switch the standard-resolution in Windows, when he changes from playing a PAL game and then a NTSC game, which can be annoying.

 

Only two different screen-resolutions are needed to choose from in the STELLA menue. Everything else, when the user knows these resolutions, can then be set and configurated by him in his Windows operating-system. STELLA don't need to do more, only give a possibility in the emu-menue to switch between two different resolutions and everything would be perfect again with PAL roms.

Edited April 9, 2019 by AW127

[AW127]

Maybe it could be done in a way like this here (just a suggestion):

 

 

When the user turn this function ON and start a game, then STELLA should use 720x576 in fullscreen, instead of the resolution that the operating-system uses. 720x576 would make sense here, cause it's the standard PAL resolution and i suppose, that nearly all users will have this resolution ONLY with 50Hz in their normal graphic-card modes and with no other Hz-values. This would then mean, that this resolution automatically would start in the 50Hz mode then and can be used for playing PAL roms. When the user later want to play a NTSC rom again, he can simply turn OFF this mode again by klicking the function again.

 

And for users, which are already satisfied like it is now at the moment, it would also be no problem. Cause these users simply don't need to use this new "Use 720x576 resolution for fullscreen" function.

Edited April 9, 2019 by AW127

[AW127]

Hello? Earth calling earth calling....

[Thomas Jentzsch]

We are discussing...

[AW127]

We are discussing...

 

 

Nice, discussing is always good.

 

And i wanted to say, that i am happy, that it looks like, that allowing two different fullscreen-resolutions will come now. At least, it sounds this way on Github.

 

By the way, cause i read there on Github

 

https://github.com/s...ella/issues/285

 

that "stephena" (sa666666) wrote there, that he don't knew LCD monitors which can do 50Hz.

 

There really are some LCD-models, that work in 50Hz modes. Especially "Syncmaster" and "BenQ" models often can do the 50Hz modes without a problem. For example in the Amiga community the BenQ BL702A and the BenQ BL912 are quite famous here in Europe, cause they not only can do 50Hz without a problem, they also support 15kHz signals.

 

When i look at the flatscreen-monitors from some of my retro-friends (which i did in last months because of interest) i would say, that around one-third of them support 50Hz without a problem. But, of course, all CRT monitors can do 50Hz or 100Hz (i know alot of people which still have one, they use for retro-gaming with emulators for example) AND there are also all the flatscreen TV`s here in Europe, which ALL supports 50Hz or even 100Hz (the more expensive ones). Alot of them can also be connected to the PC and used with STELLA for example. So, i would say, it really makes sense, to add switchable fullscreen-resolutions and thereby give the possibility to use different Hz-values for PAL and NTSC games. When i look in 60Hz and then in 50Hz at the movement of the bird-enemies in level 3 and level 4 of the game "Phoenix" for example, then the difference really can be seen.

 

NOTHING MORE than giving possibility to switch between two different resolutions, is needed from STELLA. Like i said before, setting all the Hz-values can be done in the operating system. And i really would take the standard PAL resolution 720x576 for this, cause then the vast majority of the users don't need to create a new custom-resolution with 50Hz, because 720x576 in the most cases is only available with 50Hz in the standard graphic-modes of the graphic-card, while nearly all other resolutions exist there with different Hz-values, like for example with values like 60Hz and 75Hz in my case here. When such a resolution would be used, the users must create a 50Hz Hz-value by making a custom resolution first. And this step would not be necessary, when 720x576 will be used as the new switchable fullscreen-resolution. And also STELLA then don't need to distinguish between the different Hz-values then. When for example 1024x768 would be used as the new second fullscreen-resolution and the users would have this resolution then with 50Hz, 60Hz and 75Hz in their graphic-modes (while 50Hz is the new made custom-resolution) then it would be necessary, that STELLA automatically must take the 50Hz mode of these resolution and not one of the other Hz-values, or that STELLA shows all the resolutions together with their Hz-values. This all would not be necessary, when using 720x576, cause i have never seen a PC until now, where this resolution is available in another Hz-value than 50Hz in the standard graphic-modes. Only when a user would set a new custom resolution "720x576 - 60Hz" then this would be the case, but why should anybody do this, when 60Hz is available from the beginning on for ALL other resolutions?

 

It is not absolutely required, that STELLA sets the correct fullscreen-resolution for PAL roms automatically, in my opinion (cause i read about this on Github). When this would be possible it would be the perfect solution, but when realizing this makes a problem, then it can also be done manually as a clickable option, like i showed it in my screenshot in the previous entry. It's just a click on this new function which would be no problem manually and maybe switching between the fullscreen-resolutions, could also be integrated in the keyboard-shortcuts (CTRL + "?") or (ALT + "?"). There should be some combinations free i think, for a new shortcut (would also be good for quick switching and seeing the differences, when a 50FPS game runs in 50Hz and then in 60Hz mode). Then, making this manually, would be no problem at all.

 

And STELLA users, which

 

- don't play the PAL versions of the games at all, cause they are used to the NTSC versions anyway

- have a flatscreen-monitor that can not run in 50Hz (some models can not go deeper than 56Hz i. e.)

- and don't have an older CRT-monitor they use for retrogaming

- and also don't have the possibility to use a flatscreen TV which can do 50Hz mode (non-europe TV maybe)

 

simply don't need to use this new "switch to 720x576 fullscreen-resolution" function at all. Then nothing changes for them and everything works like before. So, everybody can be satisfied.

Edited May 26, 2019 by AW127

[AW127]

I forgot to mention one thing, which comes to my mind right now. Even for people which have a LCD-monitor model, that dont support 50Hz mode, a second fullscreen-resolution for PAL games makes sense.

 

Simply for the reason, that a 75Hz fullscreen-mode also looks better for PAL games than a 60Hz mode. Not so good like 50Hz or 100Hz of course, but definately better than 60Hz. In last years, i tried around alot in emulators of other systems (C64, Atari-800XL, Atari-ST, Amiga, SuperNES, MegaDrive ...) and there this can be seen very good, especially in games which have scrolling of course. When the monitor can not do 50Hz or 100Hz, then use 75Hz for playing PAL-games instead of the normal 60Hz standard, this is the rule. So those people then can make a new custom-resolution in their graphic-card settings with "720x576 - 75Hz" and use this then as the second fullscreen-resolution for playing PAL games.

Edited May 26, 2019 by AW127