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Hello Jürgen

 

This might be a dumb idea, but:

 

If you'd change the layout of the PCB so the square chips are closer to the ANTIC and maybe move the small chip to the bottom of the PCB, wouldn't it be possible to shorten the PCB by a couple of centimeters? That might leave enough space for the UAV and the RF modulator (or whatever is mounted in its location) without the extra mods. The text is nice, but not really needed for anything electronically.

 

Sincerely

 

Mathy

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Hi all,

 

all owners of the previous V4.2 version of my SRAM memory expansion got (or it´s in shipping already) a free exchange to the new V4.3 if they had fitting problems.

 

All manuals and the info PDF file has been updated. Please use the V4.2 version only for XE computers and the XEGS. The new V4.3 version fits in all Atari computers incl. the 600XL.

 

Check my info PDF (see post #1) for availability.

 

Jurgen

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Is there a good program/demo that will display status of stereo pokey is detected with hopefully no keyboard required? In my 800XL that is now faulty since the pokey socket was replaced, I tried ROger's bad apple since I can control it with joystick, and it was showing no stereo pokey detected on start screen.

 

Also, with stereo upgrade installed, will any audio come out the original monitor jack without any additional wiring, or do I have to wire the output from the stereo board. Sorry if this is in the manual already.

 

Hopefully I will have success in a 2nd 800XL.

Edited by Nezgar

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Is there a good program/demo that will display status of stereo pokey is detected with hopefully no keyboard required? In my 800XL that is now faulty since the pokey socket was replaced, I tried ROger's bad apple since I can control it with joystick, and it was showing no stereo pokey detected on start screen.

 

Also, with stereo upgrade installed, will any audio come out the original monitor jack without any additional wiring, or do I have to wire the output from the stereo board. Sorry if this is in the manual already.

 

Hopefully I will have success in a 2nd 800XL.

 

Hi,

 

found some Stereo test tool and demos in the attached ATR file. There´s a "Stereo Test Utility" by Raster included. Even is this tool detects no stereo mode, it tries to play stereo. That´s a behavior I mentioned in the manual already. Not all combinations of POKEYs will be detected by the "register test" as used in this tool, but the solution will work. In the ATR file there´s the "Selfdemo" by C.P.U., this one shows at startup a nice splash screen when Stereo is detected. Otherwise "Only Mono" will appear, but if your stereo board is fine, the demo plays in stereo. Best hearable at the "RAM Test".

 

Without keyboard... hmm. Didn´t try it out, but maybe the PICODOS installation I used can be controlled by joystick. Otherwise you´ve to copy the selected files to a seperate DOS disk renamed as AUTORUN.SYS. This should be boot without any key press needed.

 

When pressing "A" for audio test after loading the Stereo Test Tool a digitized voice and standard POKEY sound appears - first left, then right channel. Even if "no dual pokey found" is displayed. So that´s a good test.

 

Good luck, Jurgen

 

PS: The monitor jack output works normally, but only for left channel. Connect the "SR" pad from my stereoboard to pin 6 of the LM358, then also the right channel is hearable at the monitor jack (and RF modulator, too).

Stereotest.zip

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Well, I would not recommend that patched version of "Vent" on the stereotest disk. If it works on your computer then fine, but it would not surprise me if it does not work on several machines. It was patched because the original version of Vent did not work on Sven Gleich's Atari (and someone from HARD demo coders patched it for him). The strange thing is: The original version of Vent simply requires 128k RAM, port B ($D301) banking and does NOT require sep. Antic access. Just 64k RAM and 64k xRAM, block E or banks E3, E7, EB and EF. So any XL/XE with min. 128k RAM should be able to load the original version. And so I wonder why it did not work on Sven Gleich's A8 and he required a patched version - maybe his XRAM did not use block E (the standard block and standard banks for 128k machines) ?!? Anyways, the patched version now requires much more than 128k RAM to load...

 

Vent (128k min.) original version:

http://a8.fandal.cz/detail.php?files_id=1128

 

---

 

Back to topic, besides Raster's great stereotest version on the stereotest disk (with a sample saying "left channel" and "right channel"), there are also various system testers that detect a stereo upgrade and display the presence of stereo, e.g. SysInfo by KMK/Drac030 and several others. But most of these system info tools do require a keyboard. I found a stereo detection utility by Satantronic that works without keyboard, if you can fire it from a menu (gamedos/XEX-loader, etc.) it will simply display if your computer is mono or stereo...

 

Last not least: Fandal's database has more than 400 stereo programs available (most of them are demos, but there are also several games): http://a8.fandal.cz/search.php?search=stereo&butt_details_x=x

DETSTEO.xex

Edited by CharlieChaplin

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Is there a specific game/demo that /is/ able to show detection this particular stereo upgrade without a human listening for audio on the right channel?

Edited by Nezgar

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I have the same stereo board from Jurgen and Pang shows the Hardware spec before loading the full game and one of the fields is Stereo ( True/False ). The other one i can think of is Yoomp! shows as "Stereo Detected" on the Title screen.

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Is there a specific game/demo that /is/ able to show detection this particular stereo upgrade without a human listening for audio on the right channel?

Does it need to be software?

 

If it's just for checking I guess you can just read a paddle register. Something like:

 

if peek(53776)>227 then stereo

if peek(53776)<228 then mono

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Is there a specific game/demo that /is/ able to show detection this particular stereo upgrade without a human listening for audio on the right channel?

 

As I wrote above the "Selfdemo" is one of them. Or the game "Yoomp" and others. But again: Most of the programs use the same detection routine, and this one not detect always "stereo" even when stereo is running fine and the stereoboard working. So best test is: use your ears :)

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I think the Yoomp! test is pretty reliable, and is similar to the U1MB BIOS test, which is also reliable. The only scenario which appears to fool this test is the second POKEY being physically absent, which I would say is a "don't care" situation... in most cases, at least. :)

 

Trying to trigger an IRQ on the secondary chip and checking that it did not register on the primary chip is pretty foolproof providing the stereo board is either present and fully populated or not present at all. The human ear is notoriously unreliable, as evidenced by the number of U1MB users who complained that Stereo POKEY was greyed out when they updated to the alt U1MB firmware. In every case, it was not a bug in the firmware to blame, but the fact the U-Switch was faulty or wired up wrongly, meaning stereo was either on all the time or not at all regardless of the setting. And yet the users' ears told them that everything had worked all along. :)

Edited by flashjazzcat
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This sucks that I have to post this, but bringing bad news is never fun.

 

I received the v4.3 short while back and just now got to installing it in the 600XL. It doesn't fit. The NTSC RF modulator is right where it needs to sit. ONLY option on this one is to remove the RF and go to a full DIN out modification. Not what I wanted to do. At least not in the near future.

 

I also had the v.4.2 (which did not fit in 600XL, but I kept to install into my 800XL) and installed it in the 800XL. Well... doesn't fit either. I am unable to put the top with keyboard back on. There is about a 1/4" gap due to the height of the unit. This is without the heat shield installed.

 

600XL w/512k expansion v4.3

 

post-61269-0-79179900-1527729059_thumb.jpg

post-61269-0-36950200-1527729047_thumb.jpg

post-61269-0-08259100-1527729033_thumb.jpg

 

800XL w/512k expansion v4.2

 

post-61269-0-12465400-1527729141_thumb.jpg

post-61269-0-53920700-1527729123_thumb.jpg

post-61269-0-66661100-1527729148_thumb.jpg

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I received the v4.3 short while back and just now got to installing it in the 600XL. It doesn't fit. The NTSC RF modulator is right where it needs to sit. ONLY option on this one is to remove the RF and go to a full DIN out modification. Not what I wanted to do. At least not in the near future.

 

I also had the v.4.2 (which did not fit in 600XL, but I kept to install into my 800XL) and installed it in the 800XL. Well... doesn't fit either. I am unable to put the top with keyboard back on. There is about a 1/4" gap due to the height of the unit. This is without the heat shield installed.

 

1st: I already mentioned this clearly in my announcement post

 

2nd: Nezgar already states, that there are fitting problems with the NTSC 800XL he own in this thread.

 

All purchasers of the V4.2 who report issues got a free of charge exchange to the newer V4.3 version already.

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This might be a dumb idea, but:

 

If you'd change the layout of the PCB so the square chips are closer to the ANTIC and maybe move the small chip to the bottom of the PCB, wouldn't it be possible to shorten the PCB by a couple of centimeters? That might leave enough space for the UAV and the RF modulator (or whatever is mounted in its location) without the extra mods.

 

This doesn´t work it out. Of course I could make the PCB one cm (or so) less in depth, but then the both GALs with their sockets are too close to the ANTIC´s position, so that some keyboards prevent the complete 800XL case from closing correctly.

 

I test this out with a model of my PCB using "Fimo" (I don´t know the english word, it´s a kind of play dough from my kids) in over 10 different 800XL systems, each 800XL case with all five keyboard variants. The result is THIS actual version V4.3, which fits in really ALL 800XL cases and keyboard variants. Took hours to investigate, but this time I didn´t want to repeat such a silly mistake.

 

The one and only issue is the need to remove the RF modulator when it should fit in the 600XL - like also needed for VBXE. All XE and XEGS always work fine with both versions.

Maybe a smaller PCB will be possible if I would solder the GAL chips direct on the PCB without sockets, but this is a no-go for me. All programmable chips (GALs, EPROMs, Flash) has to be in sockets for maintenance purposes.

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1st: I already mentioned this clearly in my announcement post

 

2nd: Nezgar already states, that there are fitting problems with the NTSC 800XL he own in this thread.

 

All purchasers of the V4.2 who report issues got a free of charge exchange to the newer V4.3 version already.

 

Well, I feel like a total idiot now and I should. I was so excited about the product(s) I never took the time to read the details of v4.3 or look back at previous posts regarding the v4.2.

My apologies Jurgen - Was not meant to be a negative against you. I still stand behind all your products. Build quality is outstanding.

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Never feel an idiot if you make a honest mistake, people will think more of you for admitting that.

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Well, I feel like a total idiot now and I should. I was so excited about the product(s) I never took the time to read the details of v4.3 or look back at previous posts regarding the v4.2.

My apologies Jurgen - Was not meant to be a negative against you. I still stand behind all your products. Build quality is outstanding.

 

If it's a machine you intend to use and not a "collection" piece, you may just cut part of the shield with a Dremel. 8-Bit guy did the same on a C-64 to fit a dual-sid board.

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If it's a machine you intend to use and not a "collection" piece, you may just cut part of the shield with a Dremel. 8-Bit guy did the same on a C-64 to fit a dual-sid board.

 

The 800XL will not close even with the shield OFF. I already used a Dremel to cut a flap in the shield and tried both ways (with and w/o).

 

The 600XL I was able to remove the RF modulator last night. What a PITA that was. The four mounts are soldered securely in there.

 

I've ordered the kit for the 600XL to add DIN output via Best Electronics.

 

It's all good. I will get them both to work. one way or another...

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Maybe, just maybe, you can remove a part of the shielding from the RF box (not the main shield). Or, another maybe, AMenard was referring to that.

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Thanks for the stereo test suggestions, I tried Yoomp - it's a good test for me because it plays music and prints detection status on start screen without needing keyboard (while testing machine PCB only)... I can even start the game with only Joystick :)

EDIT: Big facepalm, need to RTFM before posting. Need to wire A4 to CPU pin 13. I guess I can't 'quick test' with no other connections. Back to testing. continue reading for entertainment purposes only.

-----------

I replaced the POKEY socket my 2nd 800XL tonight with a new dual wipe socket, (no lifted traces this time! practice makes perfect) and verified that the original POKEY works well in the new socket. However, when installing the Stereo Card (dated 08/2015) the system behaves as though POKEY is not present at all. I tried swapping the POKEYs between the stereo board sockets, with no difference. Thinking back to earlier in my testing the system would run, but no sound at all out of original monitor jack. (not sure which combination resulted in that) The 3 POKEYs I have are all different manufacturers, is this maybe a compatibility problem with different POKEYs?

 

So at least I can confirm the problems I was having with Stereo board were not isolated to the other 800XL, which has other problems I need to figure out (crashes after 10s+ of poweron, Swapping every IC did not fix, so must be a component)

 

2 POKEY's in the stereo board, placed above a single one in the motherboards new dual wipe socket.
post-53052-0-24057200-1528099437_thumb.jpg

Side story... While working on this machine for some reason BASIC wasn't working. It would boot and freeze with BASIC enabled, even if I replaced the chip from the other 800XL, even after reflowing the solder of all the pins on the socket. (didn't replace the original socket) I noticed some 'white stuff' (oxidization i guess) in the socket, so I sprayed some MG Safety Wash II into the socket, replaced the chip, and its working!

Edited by Nezgar

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Thanks for the stereo test suggestions, I tried Yoomp - it's a good test for me because it plays music and prints detection status on start screen without needing keyboard (while testing machine PCB only)... I can even start the game with only Joystick :)

 

I replaced the POKEY socket my 2nd 800XL tonight with a new dual wipe socket, (no lifted traces this time! practice makes perfect) and verified that the original POKEY works well in the new socket. However, when installing the Stereo Card (dated 08/2015) the system behaves as though POKEY is not present at all. I tried swapping the POKEYs between the stereo board sockets, with no difference. Thinking back to earlier in my testing the system would run, but no sound at all out of original monitor jack. (not sure which combination resulted in that) The 3 POKEYs I have are all different manufacturers, is this maybe a compatibility problem with different POKEYs?

 

So at least I can confirm the problems I was having with Stereo board were not isolated to the other 800XL, which has other problems I need to figure out (crashes after 10s+ of poweron, Swapping every IC did not fix, so must be a component)

 

2 POKEY's in the stereo board, placed above a single one in the motherboards new dual wipe socket.

attachicon.gifIMG_20180604_0131471a.jpg

Side story... While working on this machine for some reason BASIC wasn't working. It would boot and freeze with BASIC enabled, even if I replaced the chip from the other 800XL, even after reflowing the solder of all the pins on the socket. (didn't replace the original socket) I noticed some 'white stuff' (oxidization i guess) in the socket, so I sprayed some MG Safety Wash II into the socket, replaced the chip, and its working!

I don't quite get this, so forgive me for stating the obvious but you did connect A4, Bell etc to the board and the Left, Right and Common Ground to external RCA Jacks ??? as i see no evidence of headers or wires on the connection points.

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yes sorry i realized that after hitting post, and edited a note at top of previous post.... :sleep:

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I think you only get sound back out of the Monitor Jack if you connect i think SR back to the LM358 other than that it's RCA Jacks you fit to the case.

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Hi,

 

EDIT: Big facepalm, need to RTFM before posting. Need to wire A4 to CPU pin 13. I guess I can't 'quick test' with no other connections. Back to testing. continue reading for entertainment purposes only.

-----------

I replaced the POKEY socket my 2nd 800XL tonight with a new dual wipe socket, (no lifted traces this time! practice makes perfect) and verified that the original POKEY works well in the new socket. However, when installing the Stereo Card (dated 08/2015) the system behaves as though POKEY is not present at all. I tried swapping the POKEYs between the stereo board sockets, with no difference. Thinking back to earlier in my testing the system would run, but no sound at all out of original monitor jack. (not sure which combination resulted in that) The 3 POKEYs I have are all different manufacturers, is this maybe a compatibility problem with different POKEYs?

 

The A4 line is the minimum which MUST be connected to make the stereo board work fine. If you left the A4 input open, you got a floating input, which may cause in problems. In best case the POKEY one (the mono / single one) will be work normal, but it also can happen that the machine hungs up - that´s the behaviour when no POKEY is attached. Normal blue screen, but no READY or no boot sound (try to find Disk D1:).

 

Without having SR connected, there´s also no feedback to the monitor jack :)

 

Again - as explained in the manual: ALL POKEYs work fine with stereo mode. And, I never found a program, demo, game or something else which will NOT playing stereo effect (as they support stereo, of course!), even if the detection routine said "Mono".

 

You can exchange the three POKEYs you have to find a better pair, where the detection works fine.

 

This behavior affected ALL stereo upgrades, not only mine :)

 

BR Jurgen

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