What's the most advanced 2600 game?

[OldAtAtari]

Which games really push the 2600 hardware to its limits? I remember when I got Off the Wall as a kid, I thought the wiggly worm at the top and the player at the bottom looked like it could be from a 7800 game.

[up2knowgood]

Oh wow, that's a tough one. I think Stargate looks pretty great, and Phaser Patrol is really fun to play. Those two pop in my head easily, then again they are two of my favorites.

[OldAtAtari]

Stargate and Phaser Patrol. I don't have either of those! I need to try them.

[onemoretime]

As far as original games go, Solaris required a custom chip I think. Play value would be for me Pitfall II. As far as beauty goes, I m still keen on Fishing Derby.

[LidLikesIntellivision]

I don't think there's an objective answer, especially if you consider the most advanced game in the players perspective. Without knowing what goes under the hood.

 

Anyway, in the 80s, HERO seemed to be the most advanced game to me. I loved that game.

But I didn't know Escapre from the MindMaster and Tunnel Runner.Those 3d maze games really impressed me when I discovered them many years later.

 

Now we have Boulder Dash, Draconian, Super Cobra Arcade and soon an incredible version of Mappy.

Custom chips, loading games from tapes were very advanced methods in the 80s and now we have Savekey, Atarivox, and Arm microprocessor in the melody cart.

Edited June 5, 2018 by LidLikesIntellivision

[OldAtAtari]

Wow, so many games to try. Of all the games just mentioned, Solaris is the only one I own. I'll have to load the others up in Stella.

 

It's interesting to me to think of the range of complexity in the 2600 games. On one hand, you've got super simple games like Combat or Street Racer, and on the other hand, you've got some really fancy stuff going on in other games.

[CommanderGrimm]

How about Space Shuttle: A Journey into Space by Activision? To me the fact that they were able to fit a Space Shuttle simulator on a console made for Pong-style games blows my mind!

 

I agree with the Solaris mention: when I loaded it up on my Atari Flashback I felt like the guy from the Star Wars arcade commercial. I had never seen something so advanced for the 2600 before! It was like Starmaster or Star Raider but with an extra kick to it.

 

It made me want to get it on cartridge.

 

Speaking of the Star Wars Arcade Game, I felt like it too was something special. It also had some 3D effects like the trench, so thumbs up for that one.

[up2knowgood]

I don't think there's an objective answer, especially if you consider the most advanced game in the players perspective. Without knowing what goes under the hood.

Of course its very subjective, isn't that part of the fun here?

 

And one more game came to mind. Guardian, I think it's a 4k but it's got quite a bit going for it.

[Opry99er]

Look to modern games like Space Rocks.... unreal.

 

On legacy games, Space Shuttle was unbelievably advanced... required a console overlay, where you used the Atari console switches as Shuttle controls.

 

Unreal

[DCent]

Zippy The Porcupine is a 64k cart I believe. That one is up there.

[Rom Hunter]

To my knowledge Solaris was the most advanced programming achievement from the 1977-1992 period.

But perhaps Nukey or Thomas can correct me on that.

[Vinnie D.]

If we're talking classic era games and not homebrew.

Solaris: had a huge game area, some very impressive visuals, and different gameplay mechanics going on. A very advanced game.

Pitfall II: included a more open exploration style of gameplay made possible with custom chips.

Jungle Hunt: actually had paralax scrolling, something that wouldn't be commonplace until the SNES.

Double Dragon: has horrible gameplay, but the fact that it even exists is impressive. It's far longer than most Atari 2600 games, features backgrounds where most games would just use flat black, can support multiple sprites on the same line, and has background music while most 2600 games just have a short pre game jingle. Too bad it's nearly impossible to play due to terrible controls.

Battlezone: Sure it may not be the 3D vectors of the arcade, but it does a very good job of using what the 2600 can do to simulate the feel of 3D and display some impressive looking tanks and backgrounds.

[BassGuitari]

Homebrews don't count. It's like asking "Who is the best mathematician in this 6th-grade algebra class?" and someone says, "The teacher."

 

Secret Quest had a password save system which was fairly unique to the Atari, and the game itself is fairly complex.

Solaris was obviously an astounding achievement on several levels.

Radar Lock borrowed some DNA from Solaris and is a relatively sophisticated take on Afterburner.

Dragonstomper is, IMO, the one game for the Atari that can truly be called an RPG.

Winter/Summer/California Games--the Epyx Trifecta--each boast gorgeous visuals and several completely different "events."

H.E.R.O. and Pitfall II pushed the 2600 about as close to its edge as the limits of 1984 tech allowed. (Or development budgets, or retail pricing, or whatever...none of which were helped by the Crash.)

Realsports Tennis was essentially a suped-up adaptation of the classic Tennis game by Activision which not only looked amazing, but also allowed players to input their names or initials.

Track & Field was a stunning title in its day and more than holds its own even against the 2600's twilight releases.

Rampage is rarely given its due, but of all the arcade titles that were ported to the 2600 in '80s, it was among the most complex, and yet sacrificed little--it has a great-looking title screen, it's got the "dateline" screens, all three characters are playable (and chosen from a very well-rendered Character Select screen) albeit obviously only two at a time, most (all?) of the arcade's gameplay elements are intact; although the in-game graphics are average, the physics are a little on the rigid side, and there only 85 cities, Rampage--as an arcade port for a system originally designed to play Tank and Pong--is a remarkable 2600 game.

Pete Rose Baseball is arguably the most advanced of all sports titles for the Atari--it even has a game mode where the CPU plays itself while you place bets! No, but seriously, check this one out, even if you're not really into baseball.

Tomcat: The F-14 Flight Simulator probably isn't the most enthralling title...but it's an honest-to-god combat flight simulator for the Atari 2600, for Pete's sake.

[awhite2600]

The question as posted is very open ended. There are no right or wrong answers.

 

You can apply more questions to the original question.

 

• The most advanced game EVER?
• The most advanced game based on the original limitations of the 2600 as designed - 4K ROM, no extra RAM or chips?
• The most advanced game using only bankswitched ROM?
• The most advanced game using more than 4K ROM and extra RAM?
• The most advanced game using custom chips, like Pitfall II?
• The most advanced game using the ARM processor technology found in the Harmony?

Personally, I'd put some of the original Activision games in the 4K ROM category. For expanded ROM, there's things like Solaris (did it use Superchip RAM too) or even the recent 8K Pac-Man homebrew. Custom chips, Pitfall II was really the only example. For the ARM technology and the new programming techniques, Draconian, the work in progress Mappy, ...the list goes on.

 

I suspect that the most advanced game ever is still to come. Every year I'm amazed at what the talented homebrew coders are able to squeeze out of the lowly 2600.

[Wyluli Wolf]

I always thought the graphics in Kung Fu master looked pretty amazing for an older 2600 game.

[OldAtAtari]

Ok, all these answers are great, and I'm excited to try some games. But let me rephrase a little more specifically, given my original intent:

 

What games really push the 2600 in-console circuitry to its limits? Which games make the most out of the inherent built-in ecosystem? This does not include games that have in-cartridge circuitry enhancements (see below for exceptions). I'm talking about software being fed into the 2600 hardware. Legacy or Homebrew is fine here. Any software that pushes the envelope of what the 2600 is capable of.

 

That was my original intent.

 

That being said, I also want to hear about games that do have extra in-cart enhancements. Though if you mention one of those, it would be good to note that it's enhanced in such a way.

 

Thanks.

[+hloberg]

advanced or complex. Atari-cube is a game I have yet to figure out how it was done. stargate is another that really pushed the boundaries. pitfall II had an additional process that gave birth to the DPC+ . as for technologically advanced I would have to say Pitfall II for its additional processor on the cartridge.

[Omegamatrix]

Some really good choices already for the old era games. Ithink H.E.R.O. looks amazing for a 2600 game.

 

For pushing hardware to the limits, I think Meltdown, the Care Bears game, and Kabobber, and Rocky and Bullwinkle are all worth a mention although they are protos. Meltdown did tricks with NUSIZx, Care Bears with REFPx, Kabobber with RESPx, and Rocky and Bullwinkle used early HMOVEs.

 

For homebrews I would say Thrust+ still is pretty advanced and still holds up today. I am impressed with the scrolling in it, and how it does not distract. Strat-o-gems also has some nice features like the logo shine, and replays. Anything Supercat does is great stuff. He is one of the best programmers for the 2600.

 

For homebrews using the ARM I would give the nod to SF2. There is a crazy amount of stuff going on there. I know Draconian is doing more with CDF (like speech samples in game), but there are many creative surprises in SF2.

[+wongojack]

I like a lot of these choices. I haven't seen Ghostbusters or River Raid II mentioned yet. Tapper is also very impressive as an arcade re-creation although I'm not sure how advanced it is. Ms Pac Man and Millipede fit in here in the same way . . . maybe Joust.

[Jim Pez]

"In Search of the Golden Skull." It was never released but a finished version was made and some people did get a chance to play it back in the early 80's. It required 16 k rom and 2 k ram in the cartridge.

Edited June 6, 2018 by jim1174

[iesposta]

It’s nice to see so many Retro gamers embrace the use of extra cart circuitry such as DPC+, CDF, and the use of idle ARM processor time!

 

Originals I would agree with what has already been stated. Millipede being a personal favorite — it just keeps getting harder and faster and I haven’t found the limit even scoring over 335,000 points.

Homebrews by the best assembly coders. Star Castle Arcade created a custom bankswitching and coding that halts and continues processing at a later time if cycles run out.

 

Most of the NES library used cart hardware extras to extend that system’s life because it was already 2 year old, under-powered hardware when it released in the US.

I just heard something like making the NES play SNES games, because the cartridge contains an entire SNES system, and the old NES is just used for power, controllers, and to send out the display signal. That is bypassing most of the original system!

 

The above situation is a huge difference from 2600 carts with extra RAM, and ARM computer because the original 2600 system cannot be bypassed — regardless of what’s done inside these modern carts. All that can be used is the same today as back when the Atari VCS first released — two 8-bit “Sprite player” objects, two 1-bit missile objects, one 1-big ball object, Playfield object of 40 very wide pixels, and background color, the display generated by the 1.76MHz 6507 that still only has 76 processor cycles per scan line, etc.

 

Unlike computers, the 2600 console has no processor upgrades, no RAM upgrades, no sound upgrades, so every cart made is a 2600 game that should work on every console. Doing these things to a 2600 console would be cheating, also to some extent Stuffing values onto the computer’s bus directly is kind of cheating (but Atari developed the Stuffing technique) which would make slightly more advanced games because it allowes the largest number of changes in a single 76-cycle scanline.

 

Had there not been the videogame crash, the 1984 games and prototypes show that coders were figuring out how to push the system and create games that amazed, and later even more advances as shown in Solaris, hardware like the Supercharger RAM cart with multi-load capability of up to 256 6K game programs (of which only one game used 5 loads) had the potential to provide huge, in depth entertainment.

[bigfriendly]

When I close my eyes and think about the games that blew me away all those years ago the Starpath Supercharger games are what I envision first. Especially Dragon Stomper and Escape from the Mind Master. Both games offered a lot of depth and challenge.

[Supergun]

Both during that time period, as well as to this very day, I find these games to be among the most impressive:

 

River Raid & Sea Quest

Both incredible games with excellent visuals & sounds. They had tons of enjoyment to them & lots of replay value.

 

Subterranea

My personal most favorite shooter on the system.

 

Jungle Hunt & Ms. Pac-Man

Not only incredible arcade translations, but also extremely addictive & fun to play. Graphically, they did things I didnt know the Atari could do.

 

HERO & Pitfall 2

Hands down the most impressive games to me. You truly got the feeling of limitless exploration when playing them. The best of the best on the system.

 

Montezumas Revenge

Probably my personal most favorite game on the system.

 

And for the record, back in 1984, consumers didnt know or care how much memory a cart had, or what extra chips were inside, etc. It wasnt cheating to be innovative & smart to come up with new ideas to squeeze more life out of this old out dated console.

 

If a cartridge plugs into a stock system and works, then it counts. Period.

[Rom Hunter]

Beamrider is amazing as well.

IMO one of the best VCS shooters.

 

[zzip]

Jungle Hunt: actually had paralax scrolling, something that wouldn't be commonplace until the SNES.

I don't feel like this was that uncommon in the era. Maybe on the 2600, but the Atari 8-bit/5200 had games doing it. Moon Patrol, Drop Zone and others.

 

 

Battlezone: Sure it may not be the 3D vectors of the arcade, but it does a very good job of using what the 2600 can do to simulate the feel of 3D and display some impressive looking tanks and backgrounds.

I actually prefer the 2600 visuals to the vectors! It looks amazing.