Vertically rolling image in game

[OldAtAtari]

I picked up a copy of Space Shuttle a few weeks ago and finally got around to trying it today. Much to my dismay, the picture rolls vertically. The contacts seem clean enough. Has anyone else seen this phenomenon? Is there a fix for it?

 

Thanks.

[WolfAmongWolves]

Are the colors off as well? Might be a PAL cartridge.

[OldAtAtari]

Are the colors off as well? Might be a PAL cartridge.

 

The colors seem good, but then again, I've never played it before, so I'm only guessing. I should double check the colors against online screenshots.

[WolfAmongWolves]

I have a few PAL cartridges, and they all have that vertical rolling issue. I still have an old TV with a vertical hold knob, so it's easy to fix. You just have to accept the weird colors. I'm not sure if there is a fix for a more modern TV though.

[OldAtAtari]

I bet somebody sold me a PAL cartridge! I guess that's going to happen sometimes.

 

Thank you!

[+-^CrossBow^-]

I will have to check that as well. You using your modded 7800 for it? I can test that later tonight with mine and see if it something odd with how that game works on my setup?

[OldAtAtari]

I will have to check that as well. You using your modded 7800 for it? I can test that later tonight with mine and see if it something odd with how that game works on my setup?

Well, yes, it was on that modded 7800, but I believed I tried it on my other modded 7800 (Saundby) as well.

The ideal test would be for me to try it on my unmodded 2600. If it rolls there, it's certainly a cartridge issue. That's a better test, so i would suggest that you not spend any time testing on your setup, unless you just want to.

[+-^CrossBow^-]

Have you tested it on a CRT? I do seem to recall there are some legit games on the 2600 that still used slightly non standard video setups that cause havoc with my current modern LCDs but work fine on a CRT. I can't recall if Space Shuttle is one of those games but it is possible.

[OldAtAtari]

Good idea. I've got a small CRT out in the garage. Perhaps I'll drag it in and hook it up.

[OldAtAtari]

Bingo. It works great on the 2600 but rolls vertically on the modded 7800. (LCD TV) Bummer!

[OldAtAtari]

Ok! Now we're getting somewhere. It has nothing to do with the video mod. Space Shuttle has a known rolling problem on some 7800 consoles. I bet I have one of the incompatible 7800's. Almost for sure, that's the problem. Here's the AtariAge link if anyone wants to read it for themselves: http://www.atariage.com/7800/faq/?SystemID=7800#cat3_3

 

Thanks, Crossbow and WolfAmongWolves! And by the way, Crossbow, I'm still really enjoying the UAV mod. Thank you!

[+-^CrossBow^-]

Yeah... I had forgotten about that.

 

I really need to set aside the ideal games for testing consoles so I can know ahead of time before modding and let the owners know the specifics so it doesn't come as a surprise later down the line and the UAV or other mod work gets blamed. I will have to look and see if I still have the pic of your mainboard I sent you. I can look it over and see if you have C64 installed if you do, it might be interesting to cut it on one side and see what happens with Space Shuttle then.

[OldAtAtari]

So tell me more about C64... Is this a possible fix for the compatibility issues?

[+-^CrossBow^-]

C64 is highlighted in Yellow. Just cut the lead in the middle on the right hand side of this capacitor to disable it and see if it makes a difference? If not, then just put a small bit of solder on it to reattach it.

 

And yes, this is what was found out sometime ago to fix compatibility issues with these activision games and with the starpath super charger. However, it will break the 2600 version of Dark Chambers.

 

Edited July 11, 2018 by -^Cro§Bow^-

[OldAtAtari]

I tried Space Shuttle on my flea market 7800, and it works fine. Looking at that board, it does not have the C64 capacitor, so it must be an older model. I think I will cut that capacitor in my good 7800 sometime, though I don't know when I'll get around to it. I'll report back here once that's done.

 

Thank you, Crossbow!

[+-^CrossBow^-]

I think most of the real expert engineers on these boards are still stumped as to why that timing circuit was changed? See on the original '84 designed boards that appeared to be used until at least '86 they seem to be perfectly compatible with all the games including 2600 Dark Chambers. Additionally if you look at the pic of your mainboard again, you will see that just under the main crystal there in the upper left just off center, that there are two spots for 3904 transistors. I've seen only one 7800 that had both of those 3904s installed. Most of them like yours have a resistor vertically mounted in that spot but again, i'm not totally sure why. Also on newer 7800s and the one in the picture had this but it is obscured by the velcro I put on there, there is a resistor that is connected between the two ram chips there. However, that resistor and I think the extra 3904 aren't present on the original '84 - '86 production units. In fact there isn't even a silkscreen on the board for the second 3904 and that area is laid out a bit differently.

 

I'm sure there is a thread here somewhere that already documents all of these changes but not sure again, if the reasons for those changes were ever figured out.

 

My guess is simply due to way to find cost cutting measures, or changes were needed in components due to changes with additional components such as different makes of the ICs etc...

[OldAtAtari]

Yep, C64. I cut the lead where you indicated, and it fixed Space Shuttle. Thank you, Crossbow! I'm looking forward to digging in and learning how to play Space Shuttle.

 

I did have another Activision game StarMaster that rolled vertically, and the C64 fix did not resolve that one. It still rolls (slowly rolls), but it's not a game I care about so much, so I'm fine with it. Maybe it's a PAL game, as WolfAmongWolves suggested.

 

Thanks again, Crossbow!

[+-^CrossBow^-]

I've never had a problem with Star Master as it isn't one of the games known to have issues. So that could very well be a PAL copy you have I suppose. And I know Star Master works on 7800s cause I play that game pretty much anytime I fire up my 7800 for any length of time. But there are always revision differences that will effect how games work differently. For instance, I'm kinda gutted to find out that my copy of Risky Rick doesn't seem compatible with my composite modded colecovision as it won't let me get past one of the screens. But on my RF output only CV I have as a backup, the game works fine. I doubt it is the composite mod at fault and there is something else different in those CVs to blame for it.