Eprom burning.

[chevymad]

I'll start off saying I'm probably doing something that I shouldn't.. But doing it anyway. I'm burning a 2532a eprom for my 87 firebird. The minipro doesn't do 2532's so I built an adapter to 2732. It crosses 2 legs and a third is connected with 2 diodes. It will burn and verify fine on my minipro and I'm using a chip I burnt that way right now.

 

What I'm trying to do that isn't working is to use Dropcheck's Rolph David atari eprom burner. I have her 2732a adapter and I'm putting my 2532 to 2732 adapter into that.. I know.. tower of adapters and I'm not having any luck. I thought perhaps my file was incompatible. So I burned a chip with the minipro and put it in the atari burner to read the file. Figured then I could use that file to burn a new chip. But when I do this, I get a very small file only 375bytes instead of 4k. Also if I take that chip I just tried to read, put it back in the minipro the data has changed and it will no longer verify.

 

I have some 2732a chips coming. So I may just try to burn one of them and use a conversion board in my car. But if possible i'd like to just use the 2532.

 

As you see, I don't "need" to make the Atari burn my new tune to the chip. I just really want to say I did when I show the car.

 

Anyone have any suggestions? Or am I just trying to do something that will never happen?

[Osgeld]

375 bytes is not far off from 4k bits (aka 500 bytes) and not everyone (especially the auto industry) packed every single bit full of data ... there's a lot of 0's

 

as far as changing bits make sure your not using some generic profile and set voltages specific to the make and exact model of chip ... and make sure there's nothing else sharing the usb port as even motherboard ports are shared though a hub so the available current is split limiting the boost voltage of the mini-pro which is taking 5 volts jack shit current and boosting it up to 20 something volts (maxed) 1970's level current

Edited April 30, 2019 by Osgeld

[chevymad]

Guess I got my bytes and bits mixed up. lol Sorry only 375bits. The minipro works fine. It's the atari burner I'm trying to make work. Also wondering why trying to read the chip with the atari burner will change the chip.

[+Nezgar]

Can you provide details about your 2732>2532 adapter? "crosses 2 legs and a third is connected with 2 diodes" ?

 

I've used a 2532 adapter by Dave Stevenson to good success programming and reading with a TL866, some details here:

http://atariage.com/forums/topic/285971-2532-eprom-uses-adapter-for-tl866/

 

But simply, this is what it does:

2532 pin 18 to 2731 pin 21 (A11)

2532 pin 20 to 2732 pin 18 (PD)

2532 pin 21 to 2732 pin 20 (Vpp)

 

No diodes.

 

Now regarding the Ralf David programmer software... I had a similar issue with 2732's... see this thread: http://atariage.com/forums/topic/274538-2732-eproms-not-working-on-ralf-daviddropcheck-burner/

 

In summary, the 2732 support was 'bolted on' to the existing software, and has some bugs. Specifically, I performed these 2 steps to succeed with programming 2732's :

1. Make sure to choose <P> Destination Params and manually enter $0000,0FFF even though that's whats already showing up top.
2. Block out ambient light from the EPROM window during programming! I found that with my LED room lights on, the programming would move much slower, and produce continuous errors every few hundred bytes. Just covering it with my finger when I discovered this showed an immediate improvement in speed.

[chevymad]

This is the adapter. http://www.vcfed.org/forum/showthread.php?23775-Bin-files-for-EPROM-burning!/page8 I think there was some more info on the page before as well. Works fine on the minipro, so I figured it oughta work on the Ralf David. But even just trying to read a preprogrammed chip will change the data on the chip. Thanks for the tips, and I've seen your post before and was doing both of those allready.

[chevymad]

I think I see my issue, or at least one anyway. I ordered 2532A's from china. I recieved 2532JL. These would be the 25v version correct? Got my 2732As today so I'll give them a try instead.

[+Nezgar]

Mine are "TMS2532A-45JL" - So these use 21V programming voltage.

 

Apparently 2532 without the "A", ie TMS2532JL-45 use 25V programming voltage... So they may have issues if programmed with a programmer that can only do 21V.

 

Can't remember what the JL means

I think "J" means 24 pin CDIP

and "L" may mean ceramic, (as opposed to M for plastic)

 

Here's another page that has good visuals of the 2532 (non A) datasheet and adapter wiring:

http://www.simonsdialogs.com/2015/08/tms-2532-eprom-adapter-one-byte-every-50-ms/

 

Maybe try the adapter with only the straight-thru wiring that seems to be all that is required in other examples? If the Atari programmer is changing bits, maybe you have a connection to pin 21 from something other than 20 on the 2732 side..

[chevymad]

Ya, these are 2532JL with no A in there. The auction of course says 2532A and even shows a chip with 2532A on it. Prints so faint on my chips, I need my readers and a magnifier to make it out on most of them.

[chevymad]

Having no luck with the 2732A's either. Although I can read a programmed chip without changing the chip data. Still won't burn one though. I'm beginning to think there's something wrong with my burner.

[+Nezgar]

Having no luck with the 2732A's either. Although I can read a programmed chip without changing the chip data. Still won't burn one though. I'm beginning to think there's something wrong with my burner.

 

 

Did you test the programming voltage with a multimeter? You can adjust the really sensitive trimpots as described on page 10 of the manual.

 

Maybe it's off-spec...

 

Also, what brand of 2732A are you using. I believe I had success with ST brand. Others may not be compatible.

[carlsson]

As for bits and bytes, a 2732 has 32 kilobit capacity, usually ordered as 4 kilo * 8 bits which will equal 4096 bytes. If you're reading 375 bytes, that is too little. If you're reading 375 bits, that is way too little. At first I was also confused by this bit and byte teminology around EPROMs and their capacity but it is starting to become clear that 2716 = 2 kB, 2732 = 4 kB, 2764 = 8 kB, 27128 = 16 kB and so on upwards.

[1050]

I just had a reverse brain fart, capturing one instead

of generating one.

 

Dear possible noob - you are aware that one needs to

bake an eprom for 20 minutes under UV light eraser

in order to make one blank and only then are you

supposed to write code to it? Right?

 

Oddly enough the issue is unset bits only. If

one were to rewrite different code without erasing,

the results would be changed code for only those bits

that happened to be still set with the original code

written.

 

Once you've stored a zero in an eprom memory cell, you

can not change it back to a one until it is exposed to

20 minutes of UV light.

 

EEPROM is able to do this without the UV light and perhaps

you come from the land of flash memory then?

 

Just something in the way you explained it, made sense

only if the above were attempted. Ignore if not applicable.

[chevymad]

Yes, i'm erasing with a UV eraser. I've reset the voltages they were off by about 0.2v to the high side. Still no joy. I'm able to burn these same chips just fine with my minipro, just haven't been successful at all on the Atari. I'm currently awaiting some 2532A chips from China. I sent them a pic of the 2532JL's I recieved and they've decided to send me the correct ones. I've also built the other style adapter without the diodes. This didn't change anything. Minipro works with either. I'll be trying to program the 2732a's again soon, but I've discovered that I can't use them in my ecm anyway (ecm uses a special prom holder). But at least they "should" work in the Atari burner.

[+Nezgar]

I'm hopeful that your issue is simply using non "A" variants that are designed for 25Vpp, and the 2532A's will be better. The TL866 may tolerate the non-A's better.

 

I have a feeling its difficult for the programmer to maintain 21V from the 5V source in the Atari...

 

Also... whats the speed rating on your non-A's? Unless asked, ebay sellers would send me 450ns 2532's, I got some 200ns ones when I asked.

 

Maybe the RD burner doesn't like the slow 450ns speed, if those are what you have...

[chevymad]

Decided I'd try reseating the PIA chips. Took them both out, the swapped them for the heck of it. The burner won't show ready at all with the chips swapped. Swap them back and it goes on to the menu like everything's working. I'm thinking one of the PIA's is no good. Searched the forum and found the original thread by Dropcheck. If she's reading this probably thinks I'm crazy, since we did this whole thing once before. I'd gotten my chips from a cheap chinese source and she had doubts about their authenticity... Back then I said I got one chip to burn, but if I did that would be the only successful one. Looks like i'm shopping for pia's. I had no recollection of the previous issues.. Must have killed that brain cell somewhere.

[+Nezgar]

I guess you could test the PIA's individually inside the Atari too.

[1050]

It's not as simple as that with the RD burner when

it comes to PIAs. The very best PIAs were found to

not work there in one slot but will work everywhere

else oddly enough. The other slot needs a retro version,

Dropcheck's advice needs to be followed to the

letter here - I would get your PIAs from her if you

want them to work. I'm hoping she has gathered up a

source of suitables without knowing that in fact she

has any for sale now. Last I knew she didn't but that

was quite a while ago now.

[chevymad]

I screwed up and somehow ordered 6522s.. So since I had my 800xl apart to update the U1mb, I stole it's PIA. I've identified which PIA of my original 2 was a total loss now. If it's in the first position the board will never show ready. But using the Atari PIA and the one "good" conexant I still get an error code of $0d @ $ff. But this is still with the JL chips instead of the A's. My A's were sent requiring a signature so the post office has them hostage. Also interesting, all my 2732A's will not show empty. I've got them in the eraser for a good long stint now to see if that changes.

 

$0d isn't in the manual list for error codes. Anybody know what it means?

[+Nezgar]

It might mean an unexpected byte of value $0D was read at location $FF, or vice versa...

 

Also when programming, use the 'slow' mode not 'fast', can't remember if that was mentioned before...

[chevymad]

2 new Atari PIA chips, checked voltages, 2532A and 2732A chips, burned a chip with my pc then read the file back into the Atari with the Ralf David burner. But, when I try to burn either type of chips, I now get a code $64 @ $ff on all chips. I'm thinking of just ordering a chip that's known to program well on this burner, just to see if it works at all.

[chevymad]

Tried using my 800xl instead of my 1088xel. Still won't burn any of my eproms. Also tried uping the voltage a bit, no joy. I have a 2764 coming to see if I can burn that.

[Dropcheck]

Not strictly programming...... but an alternative to having to burn 2732 eproms. Use a 2764 and do this trick. You'll need to run this link through a translator.

[chevymad]

I'm stuck with a 2532 for the device I'm wanting to burn for. It has a special eprom holder instead of a socket.

 

I recieved a 2764 yesterday. Just tried burning it, and it shows it completes, and verifies on the atari burner. But when I put it in my tl866 and try verifying against the file it fails. Nearly completely different.

[Dropcheck]

I'm stuck with a 2532 for the device I'm wanting to burn for. It has a special eprom holder instead of a socket.

 

I recieved a 2764 yesterday. Just tried burning it, and it shows it completes, and verifies on the atari burner. But when I put it in my tl866 and try verifying against the file it fails. Nearly completely different.

 

What file are you burning with the RD burner and have you tried the chip in it's intended installation to see if it works? Say Atari XL/XE OS installed in a 800XL or 130XE.

 

Some PC burners have multiple file types Intel, Hex, Binary etc that it can burn in and if you try verifying with a previously burned eprom and have a mismatch in the file type you will get errors.

[chevymad]

XL/XE OS won't fit on a 2764 right? As far as I know, I have no place i can use a 2764. I'm just using it to try and verify that my setup will indeed burn an eprom. File I used is a binary for a different chip. To try and rule out a file mismatch, I burned the 2764a first with the tl866 and verified it. Then I read it in the RD atari burner. Ereased my eprom and burned it back to 2764a. All seemed to work fine. When I verify on the atari does it give any indication of it being good? I hit verify it does something then back to the main menu.

 

After this I tried to verify the chip again on the tl866, but it was all different. I have seen where I can change from hex to binary etc. Didn't think of trying that.

 

So I think my burner is indeed working now. Which brings me back to burning 2732A and 2532A eproms. What speeds or brands may work better? Both sets I have are 450 nanosecond. Most of the 2732a's won't even show empty on the Atari, but do on the tl866. All of the 2532A's show empty, but won't program. Even after attempting to burn both versions will show empty afterwards.