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The review of A-Z of Atari ST Games Volume 3 book RetroLaird is trying to delete!

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I hate posting if it takes the very essence of this thread off course, but, to (in my opinion) put a bit of meat on what Vince has recently said, I was recently informed by the "in laws" that a teenage nephew and teenage niece were "getting a hard time" - they were, I was told, being bullied.

I asked if they were being physically attacked, having things thrown at them etc - nope.

I then asked if they were getting verbal abuse, being shouted at, being called names at school / in the street etc - nope.

Being the naive guy I am, I then asked just what the heck ARE they getting, and I was told that nasty comments were being left on their Instagram and Facebook accounts.

I said "erm, couldnt they just shut them down / delete the accounts?" , and the looks I got........it was almost as if "how dare you".

I said, genuinely puzzled, "so, if they don't read some online comments, everything else is fine?". 

Life will carry on perfectly fine without social media accounts.

 

I have never had a Bebo / MySpace, Facebook etc account, and don't see the need - Ive managed perfectly fine in life so far without, and I think (stand to be corrected) that may be what Vice was alluding to. 

 

Just to be 100% clear though, I am not condoning cyber bullying or belittling it.  I seen the effects first hand - they were very real.

 

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7 hours ago, ∞ Vince ∞ said:

Warning! Please try not to laugh to death when viewing the following.

 

This was his sniping reply to SGT.Apone's review of his A-Z of Arcade Games. Volume 1. We all seem to have missed this golden nugget so...

K reply.jpg

Also. There was nothing abusive in this review by SGT.apone, or any of his others.

The last part of point 2 put together with his comments in point 3 just underline his stunningly incomprehensible level of stupidity.
"obscure games they have never heard OFF."
3. I have an A level in English Language, there is nothing wrong with my vocabulary."
REALLY???
Can you deny the evidence of your own eyes, you tangerine tosspot?
 

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1 hour ago, LostInThePast said:

I hate posting if it takes the very essence of this thread off course, but, to (in my opinion) put a bit of meat on what Vince has recently said, I was recently informed by the "in laws" that a teenage nephew and teenage niece were "getting a hard time" - they were, I was told, being bullied.

I asked if they were being physically attacked, having things thrown at them etc - nope.

I then asked if they were getting verbal abuse, being shouted at, being called names at school / in the street etc - nope.

Being the naive guy I am, I then asked just what the heck ARE they getting, and I was told that nasty comments were being left on their Instagram and Facebook accounts.

I said "erm, couldnt they just shut them down / delete the accounts?" , and the looks I got........it was almost as if "how dare you".

I said, genuinely puzzled, "so, if they don't read some online comments, everything else is fine?". 

Life will carry on perfectly fine without social media accounts.

 

I have never had a Bebo / MySpace, Facebook etc account, and don't see the need - Ive managed perfectly fine in life so far without, and I think (stand to be corrected) that may be what Vice was alluding to. 

 

Just to be 100% clear though, I am not condoning cyber bullying or belittling it.  I seen the effects first hand - they were very real.

 

I assume you are the same generation as me - didn’t grow up with social media so some of the things that go on may be a little hard to comprehend for us but as someone with teenagers I have often wondered whether the same thing should happen - remove them from social media and thus they won’t see comments and be hurt but that is far from the point.

 

You remove them, you exclude them, you punish them, the trolls get their little victory. I decided this was not fair on my kids, why should they be excluded because some asshole teenager is being a dick on social media.

 

Bullies will exist in all formats, that can be down the pub, at school, at work, on social media, even within your own family. What do you do? Stop going to the pub? Stop going to school? Stop going to work?

 

It’s too simplistic to say ignore, unplug, whatever - I can see where Vince is coming from - but the problem in my opinion isn’t people getting upset from trolling - it’s the trolling. Let’s not let them have their little victories, let’s call them out for the scum that they are. 

 

I’m fine if people don’t agree with the above, happy to hear others views, just my point of view and apologies for going off topic.

Edited by Deathray Specs

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A lot of good points being made here, and I can see all sides of the argument - a genuine adult discussion, with different points of view put forward very eloquently.....unlike the bile usually posted by our stalker friend....

 

 

Oh, Deathray Specs, Im a 60's child (just), so yeah, I'm a dinosaur according to the "young 'uns", lol.

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I had a facebook account until I deleted it, a few months after Cambridge Analytica scandal.

I don't want to get twitter account, but I changed my mind when I found a bot that could share my articles from my website.

I fell down the rabbit hole, subscribing to everyone that I followed on other services like youtube.

I started tweeting while I was integrating the bot into my website.

 

Horacegate was the first time I realized I had got trolled.

The one saving thing is that these troll have NOT to hit me personal or professional, witch it sounds like where the trolls have wounded most of the posters on this thread.

 

Edited by tomasparks

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*

This week I designed a game and next week I am taking a week off to look into making a quick demo of that game, so if I get mentioned I won’t be here to respond, but first, I just wanted to clarify or put into context my views on this.

 *

 

I grew up in the eighties and nineties where I was subject to bullying, face to face physical and verbal.

 

I got suspended seven times for fighting and not one of those fights did I start.

 

So that has in some ways moulded my character as an adult.

I don’t pull punches, but I don’t go after people for no reason either.

 

I speak my mind and that upsets some people but there are no sides to me and I am quick to forgive and apologise in the main as well.

 *

 

My point about social media is that I personally don’t get Twitter and why anybody would want to open a door to literally anybody to walk though and take part in your life. Fuck no. All this DMs business, it’s a direct communication with anybody. Scary stuff !

 
Games and game programming were a Godsend, to me, and that's what I am in the scene for, games.

 

I do not, have not and will not condone any form of bullying. My pull the plug comments were, were they not prefixed by “If it all gets too much” - Worst case scenario.

 

If you feel it is so bad that it is making you ill. Go ahead, save yourself. Switch it off, pull the plug.

 

Go have a bath, make something nice to eat. Start reading a new book. Go sit in the garden and read. Listen to the radio or get out your guitar.

 

I know how it can affect people as well, again though my own experiences (younger relatives who have had issues like that). 

 

When I pulled the plug from Facebook, the only social media I ever had, a whole bunch of dark clouds cleared away and I remembered who I was again.

 

All the news, all the constant talk of Brexit. All the negativity!!

 

I don’t like the way the Social Media companies exploit the pain and suffering of their users and fail to act on reports of bullying, abuse or posting of inflammatory or evil material.

 

As a coder I know it would be incredibly simple for twitter to reject all posts containing racism, misogyny, hatred and intolerance and by doing so would shut down 95% of it in one go; but they choose to allow it just like Facebook does.

 

This is a HUGE part of the problem, by not tackling this stuff, they are effectively enabling and endorsing the behaviour of their users.

 

Back to specifics.

 

If you are wondering, yes it does rile me when the boy blunder quotes me, but they are my opinions all the same (the ones he hasn’t taken out of context, at least).

 

I don't care if anyone agrees. That is my right of opinion.

Edited by Guest
truncated - but not distorted - Sans life story

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3 hours ago, Landstalker said:

The last part of point 2 put together with his comments in point 3 just underline his stunningly incomprehensible level of stupidity.
"obscure games they have never heard OFF."
3. I have an A level in English Language, there is nothing wrong with my vocabulary."
REALLY???
Can you deny the evidence of your own eyes, you tangerine tosspot?
 

You have an A level in English Language yet you continually mangle what should be your native tongue on the printed page.
I have my grades 1 and 2 TESLA diplomas, Teaching English as a Second Language.
Perhaps I could give you some pointers?

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7 hours ago, ∞ Vince ∞ said:

Right I fully appreciate all your views on this.

 

 *

This week I designed a game and next week I am taking a week off to look into making a quick demo of that game, so if I get mentioned I won’t be here to respond, but first, I just wanted to clarify or put into context my views on this.

 *

 

I grew up in the eighties and nineties where I was subject to bullying most days of my life for more than a decade because I was a working class kid in schools with mostly upper middle class kids who’s mum’s and dad’s were teachers lawyers doctors and dentists. Some of them were even politicians professors and bank managers.

 

They had money for everything. The nice fashionable clothes, the youth-club events and trips. We/I didn't.

 

I was from the second toughest estate in my area, an estate full of working class, no nonsense people, ‘characters’ you might say; people who had done a lot of time and didn’t give a flying fuck.

 

Now when I was a kid, I got verbal abuse face to face every single day when I was at school. Some of it was very bad.

The reasons for which I won’t be discussing here, needless to say they were neither things I had done wrong, nor were they anything I could change or do anything about.

When I was a kid being bullied generally meant you got your head kicked in, probably on a daily basis.

You had your money stolen (when you had it) and they threw your books if not you in industrial dustbins. We were all told ‘Sticks and Stones’ by parents and even teachers, effectively the suck it up line when anything verbal was mentioned.

Now they have verbal abuse. (a good thing) They didn’t then. You got told you were soft and to ‘sort yourself out’.

 

I stood up to my bullies. No one ever took my money or any of my things.

 

I got suspended seven times for fighting and not one of those fights did I start. I got warned once that I might well get expelled for an incident where I snapped and this guy that had pushed and punched me one too many times got knocked out cold. I didn’t mean to do it, he just went too far. It was a clean shot.

For that I was ejected from one class I really enjoyed for the rest of my time at the school.

 

This meant that particular ‘guaranteed C or above’ I was expecting was gone and I was deemed a bully.

 

My father came to the school and explained the situation as it was and the head teachers began to realise that rather than the bully I had been assumed to be because I was 6 foot 2 and 13 stone ‘and could do some serious damage’, I was infact the victim.

 

Well I wasn’t, because I didn’t just take it like other kids, I fought back. Once some of the older kids (year or so above me) knew I could defend myself I began hanging out with some of that year and got some respect and they backed off.

One kid in particular used to think of himself as a right hard nut, he had steel toe capped reinforced industrial work boots. He just used to rush up and stamp on people’s feet. He did it to me once. I didn’t flinch. At some point he stopped. Probably five minutes. I knew if I showed the pain I was in he would probably be on my back for a long time.

Every time I saw him from that point on he used to say ‘alright’ and I would reciprocate.

On more than one occasion I snapped and gave a bully a good go. I might not win, but I will always defend myself.

I stood up for myself. I didn’t have a whole bunch of friends who would wade in to defend me. I kept getting bullied but it got easier. I learnt how to cope. I got through it.

I got bulled by 3 of my teachers regularly as well. I remember one incident in particular where I said that ‘Shakespeare was a load of bollocks’ (I have since changed my opinion) and the teacher in question locked me in the stationary cupboard for the remainder of the class.

 

I’d walk home and it would be 50/50 that some kid was waiting to try to beat me up. My parents told me someone hits you, you hit them. I feared and fear nobody.

 

So that has in some ways moulded my character as an adult. I don’t pull punches, but I don’t go after people for no reason either. I speak my mind and that upsets a lot of people but there are no sides to me and I am quick to forgive and apologise in the main as well.

 *

My point about social media is that I personally don’t get Twitter and why anybody would want to open a door to literally anybody to walk though and take part in your life. Fuck no.

All this DMs business, it’s a direct communication with anybody. Scary stuff !

 
Games and game programming were a Godsend, to me; My computers, my magazines, they were my salvation, my solace and restbyte from my bullies at school and my troubles. I didn’t need drink or drugs.

Winners Don’t Use Drugs.

 

When I got home, I came in, I sighed a breath of relief for having made it through another day unscathed, maybe a few scratches, having picked my school bag out of the industrial bins for possibly the 100th time that year. I took off my blazer, I went to my room and played my games.

I wrote games. I designed games. In my head, in my creative space no one told me what to do. No one put me down. I created these amazing worlds that only I knew about.

My family didn’t need me moaning- they had plenty of their own things to worry about.

 

I got around all the heavy shit that was happening in my life (in and out of school) and focused my energies into my games.

 

I love games because they became an escape, pretty much the same way generations before us escaped from their troubles or the monotony of their daily lives by reading books about places they knew they would never go and to hear about things, experiences, that they knew they would never be able to see, own, experience.

 

I do not, have not and will not condone any form of bullying. My pull the plug comments were, were they not prefixed by “If it all gets too much

Worst case scenario.

If you feel it is so bad that it is making you ill. Go ahead, save yourself. Switch it off, pull the plug.

Go have a bath, make something nice to eat. Start reading a new book. Go sit in the garden and read. Listen to the radio or get out your guitar.

 

I fully understand young people are into all this stuff, stuff we didn’t have as kids. I know how it can affect people as well, again though my own experiences (younger relatives). 

 

When I pulled the plug from Facebook, the only social media I ever had, aside from that aborted, thought better of it experience with twitter, mentioned earlier, it was hard.

 

I was probably becoming addicted, I have that sort of personality, but after a few weeks a whole bunch of dark clouds cleared away and I remembered who I was again.

 

All the news, all the constant talk of Brexit and news stuff. All the negativity!!

 

I don’t like the way the Social Media companies exploit the pain and suffering of their users and fail to act on reports of bullying, abuse or posting of inflammatory or evil material. I watched a documentary before the analytics thing and left for the last time.

As long as the money rolls in they do not care a jot. Facebook Live was a disaster waiting to happen and look at all what did happen. But they made tons of money off it, so…

 

As a coder I know it would be incredibly simple for twitter to reject all posts containing racism, misogyny, hatred and intolerance and by doing so would shut down 95% of it in one go; but they choose to allow it just like Facebook does.

 

This is a HUGE part of the problem, by not tackling this stuff, they are effectively enabling and endorsing the behaviour of their users.

 

Music was another wonderful escape for me. I could always find a record where the songwriter had had the same experience.

 

On top of which self-education has been another fantastic ‘escape’ which I continue to this day.

 

Back to specifics.

 

If you are wondering, yes it does rile me when the boy blunder quotes me, but they are my opinions all the same (the ones he hasn’t taken out of context, at least).

Bloody hell Vince, it sounds like you went through some serious sh1t in your life, which I can identify with personally. I am so sorry to hear this; hopefully your post about this has brought you some cathartic strength in being able to put it down to history.

 

Like yourself, I was also bullied when I was at school by some of the other kids (all of whom that I'm in touch with on social media and have met in person since have apologized) so therefore my mindset on that is that kids are going to be kids; they can be cruel at times but these things happen, allegedly as part of "life".

 

What I never really, personally, understood were quite a lot of my teachers. Most of them would bully and abuse me during classes. Some of the other kids also witnessed this as well but never felt able to do anything to stop this from happening.

 

You see, I grew up with a stammer, so I stood out from most of the local population by not being able to speak properly.

 

Back in 2003 I joined the McGuire Programme, the same thing as the popstar, Gareth Gates, was also involved with (and still is, even now).

 

The bullying largely stopped when I left school and joined a YTS scheme for a couple of years ....

 

.... then it started up again when I started in my first job, in the town where I was born.

 

Female as well as male managers seriously bullied and abused me at that first job, in a wellknown UK supermarket.

 

One of those got taken down with a shoulder shove, after having called me a spastic during a shift the day before.  It was beautiful to see this idiot on the floor, having suffered shoulder and elbow injuries as a result of my actions to it.

 

Of course the idiot went to the police about it and I ended up going through the experience of getting arrested but ending up with a caution, that disappeared after a couple of years, which was a good thing.

 

Whilst Kieren personally never did anything of the sort to me, the major reason why I have blocked him is due to what has happened to good friends of mine including Mr T who organizes the fantastic Revival events.

 

Bullying and abuse will never win.

 

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On 4/26/2020 at 1:56 AM, ∞ Vince ∞ said:

The easiest way to get away from it all, of course is to simply shut down social media accounts.

 

People can only bully you digitally if you allow them to.

 

I feel for kids these days. They are so wired into all of it that they don't take the time to stand back and remove themselves from all the drama.

They can just switch it all off. Unplug it. Replace the sim card. Change their email.

 

Instantly it all goes away, but people are addicted to the social media, which for a lot of people in vulnerable groups can be a very dangerous double edger.

 

They share so very much of their lives and so openly that they expose themselves to the digital predators. They are so desperate for likes and

false reassurance of how brilliant they are which gives them a false sense of direction and fulfilment in their lives that they get caught up in it all so obsessively it becomes unhealthy. 

If it all gets too much, log out, shut it down. Take some time off from this false half life online and try to enjoy your real life.

 

NB: NOT directed at anyone, just my observations on the cult of social media.

That is one of the worst takes I have ever seen in relation to digital bullying, never mind bullying in general. 

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Kieren "wrote" his A-Z of Phillips CD-i games in 2018.

"In 1982 Philips and Sony changed the way we listened to music forever..."

Did we not have Mp3 players in 2018?

Soundcloud started in 2007
Youtube launched in 2005
Spotify in 2008.

Forever???
Once again, the great scribe gets things terribly wrong with his cliched and sweeping statements.

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Wouldn't it be amazing if at one of the Play Expo's that will, I assume, start up again at some point, there was a panel / discussion on, eg, "the cancer in the Retro Community", where panelist's could tell all present of their personal experiences in dealing with the devious low life two-faced lying scum element of the retro world, and how it backfired, and actually, on the whole,  strengthened and united the community.  People could ask questions about how it all came to light, how each dealt with it, how to spot the signs etc, meaning the message could be spread even more, so that all the turds on the pavement of life can easily be spotted and avoided. (apologies Landstalker - your line was too good not to plagiarise, lol)

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3 hours ago, LostInThePast said:

Wouldn't it be amazing if at one of the Play Expo's that will, I assume, start up again at some point, there was a panel / discussion on, eg, "the cancer in the Retro Community", where panelist's could tell all present of their personal experiences in dealing with the devious low life two-faced lying scum element of the retro world, and how it backfired, and actually, on the whole,  strengthened and united the community.  People could ask questions about how it all came to light, how each dealt with it, how to spot the signs etc, meaning the message could be spread even more, so that all the turds on the pavement of life can easily be spotted and avoided. (apologies Landstalker - your line was too good not to plagiarise, lol)

He would simply decry any/all tales as being lies, which is his usual response to any criticism.
Nice thought though.

 

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Just a note from my watching brief on various Twitter accounts - Kieren deactivated his main account @RetroLaird on 1st April, so with Twitters 30 day ‘change your mind’ policy he’ll need to reactivate it soon or lose it for ever. The AtariFan/Retrogamerssuck account deleted around the same time but did pop up recently before disappearing again - assume this was to buy another 30 days grace before oblivion - the clock is ticking...

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15 hours ago, Landstalker said:

2020-04-29_19-35-49.png

The Liar says:

'New projects in the pipeline, one of which is very exciting indeed, but I'll drop more info on those as soon as I have permission from the relevant parties....'

 

Oh dear! He's about to destroy someone's business/project/name by being a part of what they are doing. Time will tell.

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What does anybody know about these two Retweeters?

  • Games Don't Suck @Games_Dont_Suck

Bringing you all gaming love. Hmm with some movies and other pop culture things in there to boot!

  • Gamer Geek @DataAugmented

Data Scientist by day, geek tech gamer junky by night; welcome to my augmented stream of consciousness

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13 minutes ago, tomasparks said:

What does anybody know about these two Retweeters?

  • Games Don't Suck @Games_Dont_Suck

Bringing you all gaming love. Hmm with some movies and other pop culture things in there to boot!

  • Gamer Geek @DataAugmented

Data Scientist by day, geek tech gamer junky by night; welcome to my augmented stream of consciousness

I think those are accounts that just retweet anything with the #retrogaming tag

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He's always behind the times.
More like social commentary about undeniable facts.
Silly, lonely little orange child.

2020-05-01_12-32-55.png

Once the lockdown is over and social distancing a thing of the past, my diary is always open for a face to face meeting to discuss your grievances.

Edited by Landstalker

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