moonlight_mile Posted October 9, 2020 Share Posted October 9, 2020 Hey all, I recently got an SIDE2 cart from Lotherek. I could be wrong but I think my flashed image is corrupt. Here is what it is doing: I plug it into my unmodified 130xe. Sometimes it accessed the floppy drive/sio2sd I have attached and other times it doesn’t. After it boots to the hard drive information, I get one of two results: I get a screen full of Missing ___MISC154 Symbol Not defined. Or it finishes booting and accesses the drives but never sees the drives and I need to hit the reset button to get out of this. I have attached a picture and short video describing these results. I thought maybe the firmware needed updating as I couldn’t get the cart to see my cf card either. I did manage to get the side2_full atr to boot. However all it did was spit out errors that it couldn’t upgrade the cart. I did do a dir of the car: and that is also all garbled. I included a pic of this as well. the side loader loads and does see the card but I didn’t put anything on it as I wanted to use this as a mini hard drive. Now, I am assuming I am going to have to try to flash the firmware back on it with the connector inside the cart. Do you think this is just a bad flash?What tools will I need to flash the firmware onto the cart? I thought I remember reading someone else had a problem with the side2 cart but when I searched I didn’t see anything. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moonlight_mile Posted October 9, 2020 Author Share Posted October 9, 2020 Forgot the video. IMG_2665.MOV Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+Nezgar Posted October 9, 2020 Share Posted October 9, 2020 Good power supply to the machine? I noticed side2 starts malfunctioning below about 4.7V when I was testing with some repurposed/cheap usb/phone charger type power supplies. Also have you tested with different machines, and different or no CF card inserted? Base & extended RAM tests all good in the 130XE? If there's bad XRAM maybe it corrupted some data on the way through.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+Stephen Posted October 9, 2020 Share Posted October 9, 2020 If I had to guess, I'd say it's an incompatible CF card. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moonlight_mile Posted October 9, 2020 Author Share Posted October 9, 2020 Well, I am trying to use it without the cf card and upgrade the firmware and it doesn’t want to access the drives after it boots. I did check the ram-all good. I have a newer model power supply. I think I got it from best. It is an Atari branded supply. As far as the ram test I just used the Atari default test screen. So both ram and rom showing as good. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flashjazzcat Posted October 9, 2020 Share Posted October 9, 2020 Boot with SHIFT held down and see if things get any better. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moonlight_mile Posted October 10, 2020 Author Share Posted October 10, 2020 Here is the latest. I tried booting with the shift key down. Same result. Just errors out after spartados boots and it is looking for the drives. The one time I did kind of get it to work I was jostling the cart, which led me to believe maybe there was a broken solder joint on the cart connector. I reflowed those joints and toned out the cart while it was inserted and everything had continuity. Alas, same result. I suppose it could be my 130xe but I have not had any issues whatsoever with it, with the exception of my ATR-8000 won’t boot into cp/m. But I kind of think that is still an atr-8000 issue. I tried it with my xf551 and my Percom rfd44. All the same result. Now, in the same package from lotherek I got an sio splitter. After it finishes booting and starts looking for the drive there is activity on the sio lines as the splitter has lights that show activity. And yes, I have tried all the above with the drives connected directly to the 130xe. Again, thanks for all your continued help on this. Craig. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flashjazzcat Posted October 10, 2020 Share Posted October 10, 2020 3 minutes ago, moonlight_mile said: I tried booting with the shift key down. Same result. OK. The reason I suggested this is that SHIFT suppresses loading of the SIDE driver, but perhaps pre-historic versions of the driver such as the 2011 build supplied on your cartridge lack this feature. I wondered if MEMLO was so high on this system that the extended RAM banking window was crashing into the driver. Another reason suppression of this driver would be useful is that I recall v.1.0 having a catastrophic bug which disallowed access to any serial drives. I realise this isn't the 'FJC Firmware' version of the cartridge out of the box, but why anything is supplied with such an old version of a driver which has been regularly maintained and freely downloadable for nearly a decade, I do not know. I believe the version of SDX supplied is similarly achaic. Does the SIDE Loader boot if you switch on the machine with the SIDE's 2-position switch pushed back towards the rear (top) of the cartridge case? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moonlight_mile Posted October 10, 2020 Author Share Posted October 10, 2020 OK. The reason I suggested this is that SHIFT suppresses loading of the SIDE driver, but perhaps pre-historic versions of the driver such as the 2011 build supplied on your cartridge lack this feature. [emoji6] I wondered if MEMLO was so high on this system that the extended RAM banking window was crashing into the driver. Another reason suppression of this driver would be useful is that I recall v.1.0 having a catastrophic bug which disallowed access to any serial drives. I realise this isn't the 'FJC Firmware' version of the cartridge out of the box, but why anything is supplied with such an old version of a driver which has been regularly maintained and freely downloadable for nearly a decade, I do not know. I believe the version of SDX supplied is similarly achaic. Does the SIDE Loader boot if you switch on the machine with the SIDE's 2-position switch pushed back towards the rear (top) of the cartridge case?Yes that does load and it does access the cf card when inserted. (I have an sd to cf card adapter, I know this is problematic but I was really just using it to test things. ) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flashjazzcat Posted October 10, 2020 Share Posted October 10, 2020 The SD adapter should pose no issues with the original firmware or with the latest update. By the sound of it, the cartridge works OK but you either have a corrupt SDX ROM or severe issues with the extended memory on the computer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moonlight_mile Posted October 10, 2020 Author Share Posted October 10, 2020 The SD adapter should pose no issues with the original firmware or with the latest update. By the sound of it, the cartridge works OK but you either have a corrupt SDX ROM or severe issues with the extended memory on the computer.Is there a way I can flash the latest rom on the cart using the connector inside the cart? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flashjazzcat Posted October 10, 2020 Share Posted October 10, 2020 8 minutes ago, moonlight_mile said: Is there a way I can flash the latest rom on the cart using the connector inside the cart? Unfortunately not. But you can use a TL866 or similar USB EPROM programmer to flash the removable PLCC flash ROM. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moonlight_mile Posted October 10, 2020 Author Share Posted October 10, 2020 Unfortunately not. But you can use a TL866 or similar USB EPROM programmer to flash the removable PLCC flash ROM.That I can do. I have one of those. Just not the adapter. By chance do you know what that adapter is called and is the binary file included in your zip file? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flashjazzcat Posted October 10, 2020 Share Posted October 10, 2020 Just now, moonlight_mile said: By chance do you know what that adapter is called and is the binary file included in your zip file? I just call it a 'PLCC' adapter, but they always came provided with the programmers here. The binary image you should flash using the programmer is called SIDE2.ROM and is in the 'ROM' folder of the ZIP file under the 'Download' heading here: https://atari8.co.uk/firmware/side/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moonlight_mile Posted October 10, 2020 Author Share Posted October 10, 2020 I just call it a 'PLCC' adapter, but they always came provided with the programmers here. The binary image you should flash using the programmer is called SIDE2.ROM and is in the 'ROM' folder of the ZIP file under the 'Download' heading here: https://atari8.co.uk/firmware/side/Perfect! Yeah I thought mine was supposed to come with mine but didn’t. I will look and order one. Thanks for all your help!! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+Nezgar Posted October 11, 2020 Share Posted October 11, 2020 Would be good to test your extended RAM with this program: https://www.iamretro.gr/forum/resources/xram-extended-ram-tester.1/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moonlight_mile Posted October 12, 2020 Author Share Posted October 12, 2020 Ok here are my results. I flashed the side2.rom onto the chip. it doesn’t boot into Spartados at all. It does boot into the Side loader so I think it is safe to say it flashed fine. I did try flashing it a few times all the same result. I ram that extended ram check and it did find an issue, however I am not 100% sure what I am looking at. Clearly there is an issue but would I be able to figure out what chip is bad and replace it? Attached is a pic of xram test. again thanks for the help. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+Nezgar Posted October 13, 2020 Share Posted October 13, 2020 Alright... so somethings up with Extended RAM, and possibly RAM under the OS if Disk based Sparta isn't working as well... (can it boot SpartaDOS 3.2?) Make a text file called CONFIG.SYS on D1: with the following line, and boot SDX with this disk mounted in D1: USE NONE This will tell SpartaDOS X not to use RAM under the OS, or a bank of extended memory. MEMLO will be too high for most things to run, but see if you can at least get through to the prompt and access partitions without errors... If that works, then move up to booting using RAM under the OS: USE OSRAM If that doesn't work, then either your MMU, EMMU, or maybe base RAM is still bad... To rule out the base RAM, without purchasing a sys-check from tf_hh, you can first try replacing the OS ROM with a 27c128 type EPROM programmed with Shoestring's RAM tester. In a stock 130XE, that most likely means desoldering & installing a socket though... Syscheck and Shoestring's testers are the only ones I know of that will tell you the specific IC location that is bad. Lastly, swapping R110/R111 will swap the extended and base 64K RAM, which allows testing the extended 64K with either tester since they only test the base 64K, as seen in this post: https://atariage.com/forums/topic/251315-sys-check-v22-ready-to-use-batch-available/?do=findComment&comment=4374699 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moonlight_mile Posted October 13, 2020 Author Share Posted October 13, 2020 11 hours ago, Nezgar said: Alright... so somethings up with Extended RAM, and possibly RAM under the OS if Disk based Sparta isn't working as well... (can it boot SpartaDOS 3.2?) Make a text file called CONFIG.SYS on D1: with the following line, and boot SDX with this disk mounted in D1: USE NONE This will tell SpartaDOS X not to use RAM under the OS, or a bank of extended memory. MEMLO will be too high for most things to run, but see if you can at least get through to the prompt and access partitions without errors... If that works, then move up to booting using RAM under the OS: USE OSRAM If that doesn't work, then either your MMU, EMMU, or maybe base RAM is still bad... To rule out the base RAM, without purchasing a sys-check from tf_hh, you can first try replacing the OS ROM with a 27c128 type EPROM programmed with Shoestring's RAM tester. In a stock 130XE, that most likely means desoldering & installing a socket though... Syscheck and Shoestring's testers are the only ones I know of that will tell you the specific IC location that is bad. Lastly, swapping R110/R111 will swap the extended and base 64K RAM, which allows testing the extended 64K with either tester since they only test the base 64K, as seen in this post: https://atariage.com/forums/topic/251315-sys-check-v22-ready-to-use-batch-available/?do=findComment&comment=4374699 Yes Sparta 3.2d works fine. Also Spartados x works from the ultimate Cart. Looks like I have a lot ahead of me. I will give your advice a try over the next few days. Ill keep you informed on how things go. Thanks! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+Nezgar Posted October 13, 2020 Share Posted October 13, 2020 40 minutes ago, moonlight_mile said: Spartados x works from the ultimate Cart. Hmm, as I recall SDX originally wouldn't use an extended bank unless there was more than 64K of extended RAM. (Ie with no "USE" line in CONFIG.SYS) which makes me wonder if the CONFIG.SYS baked into your SIDE2 "CAR:" device has a "USE BANKED" line. For testing, your temporary CONFIG.SYS with "USE OSRAM" can just go on a floppy drive for D1:. Type "MEM" or "MEM /X" to confirm free banks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moonlight_mile Posted October 13, 2020 Author Share Posted October 13, 2020 Hmm, as I recall SDX originally wouldn't use an extended bank unless there was more than 64K of extended RAM. (Ie with no "USE" line in CONFIG.SYS) which makes me wonder if the CONFIG.SYS baked into your SIDE2 "CAR:" device has a "USE BANKED" line. For testing, your temporary CONFIG.SYS with "USE OSRAM" can just go on a floppy drive for D1:. Type "MEM" or "MEM /X" to confirm free banks.Just to be clear all that needs to be on the floppy disk is config.sys, correct? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+Nezgar Posted October 13, 2020 Share Posted October 13, 2020 41 minutes ago, moonlight_mile said: Just to be clear all that needs to be on the floppy disk is config.sys, correct? Yes. On a sparta formatted disk. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moonlight_mile Posted October 13, 2020 Author Share Posted October 13, 2020 Yes. On a sparta formatted disk.Well I tried it. Same result. Will not boot into Sparta dos. I reads the drive for 2 seconds or so then just a blank screen. I re-flashed the rom with just the Sdx rom, the side.rom and went back to the side2.rom. Side loader works and is updated it just won’t bring up sdx. I did forget to back up the original code from the rom so I don’t have that to go back to. Does anyone have the version 1 side2 rom dump?I didn’t fool around with the resistors yet. I may try this over the weekend if you think that could be the problem. Just find it odd that v1 of the rom would boot (sort of) and the updated roms won’t burn at all. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flashjazzcat Posted October 13, 2020 Share Posted October 13, 2020 6 minutes ago, moonlight_mile said: Just find it odd that v1 of the rom would boot (sort of) and the updated roms won’t burn at all. The version of SDX on the original ROM is seven years old. Most likely the more recent version leverages your presumably faulty extended RAM differently and thus exhibits different issues. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moonlight_mile Posted October 14, 2020 Author Share Posted October 14, 2020 The version of SDX on the original ROM is seven years old. Most likely the more recent version leverages your presumably faulty extended RAM differently and thus exhibits different issues.I was afraid of this. Oh well. I will probably just look into getting a new Atari. Which would be the best to get for use with the side2 an 800xl or 130xe? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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