where can I buy a Atari SDrive-Max and Fujinet?

[AtariNostalgia]

What are the design flaws of the 1.3, can you list some?

[Mr Robot]

Simplified... So may have a few ommisions.

 

1.0 worked but had some issues sharing the SIO chain with a few peripherals (the 1088XEL SIO2PC for example), it had an occasional issue where it would backfeed power to the Atari somehow and cause some weird speaker noise when it was switched off, the switch on the side was prone to breaking if overused.

 

1.3 fixed all of those issues and added a resistor required for tape emulation but changing the USB/serial chip for a more readily available one caused an issue for a few people with certain combinations of operating systems and computer hardware used when updating the Fujinet firmware where they could not get it to connect, there were some workarounds but it was never reliable. For the majority of people there was no problem at all.

 

1.3 fixed, fixes that issue with a few bodged on components and other minor but very fiddly fixes. 

 

1.5 does the fix properly. 

 

the still in development 1.6 will have a new SIO connector with better receptacles which will grip sio cables better.

 

 

[Gunstar]

3 hours ago, Gavin1968 said:

Tommy,

The details about what is new is on the FujiNet 1.5 product page.  I have them up now.  Basically if you want to use the FujiNet with any other SIO device you want the 1.5 because it handles the SIO chain way better than 1.0 as well as high speed SIO.  1.3 has many design flaws and I would avoid.  I don't know if anyone even sells the 1.0 any more.  I only sell the latest version, 1.5

 

 

https://www.vintagecomputercenter.com/shop

 

I have the 1.0 version I bought from TBA, IIRC, but I have had no issues with it being in my Incognito 800 SIO chain with 3 real floppy drives and a 410 and the HS SIO works fine too. I will obviously get a 1.5 or later for my 1200XL (actually this one I'll make myself, installed in my 1030). The only issue I've had with my 1.0 Fujinet is that a few weeks after I got it, the power switch broke off (super cheap crap obviously there, I was perfectly gentle with it) and I've had to use a tiny screwdriver to turn it on and off since. I'll have the nice beefy power switch of my 1030 for my Version 1.5.

 

The point being, since I've had no issues at all with 1.0 in the SIO chain or with HS SIO, how exactly does the V 1.5 handle SIO better than "perfectly fine" SIO handling of my 1.0?

 

EDIT: Well, I guess @Mr Robot answered that question before I posted...I don't own a 1088XEL and there's no need for SIO2PC since Fujinet obsoletes it, so for me, there was and is no SIO issues at all. And I modified my 800 with a second SIO port, so the Fujinet is the lone device on the original SIO port, so I don't need to use the SIO port on Fujinet at all, so issues with it on the 1.0 are also a non-issue for me.

Edited June 3, 2021 by Gunstar

[Mr Robot]

Yeah, my basic advice would be, if you have a fujinet, of any version, and you are having no problems with it, you're not one of the tiny number of people affected by any of its issues; keep the one you have a don't worry about it. 

 

I'd even buy an 'unfixed' 1.3 and try to update the firmware. If it works for you, great, if not, ask to return it and get a fixed one for the couple of extra $£€ it costs for the annoying fix to be applied. Shame to see all that hardware end up in landfill somewhere for a problem that most people won't ever see.

 

Or get a 1.5 , it's all good. 

 

 

[AtariNostalgia]

34 minutes ago, Mr Robot said:

 

Or get a 1.5 , it's all good. 

 

 

Until the 1.6 and then the 2.X comes out and the problems with the 1.5 are revealed... History repeats itself.

[Sugarland]

I remember the 1.x's. Who's rollin' in their 5.0?

[nadir]

OK, you talked me into it.  I'm getting the 1.5. 

[AtariNostalgia]

47 minutes ago, Sugarland said:

I remember the 1.x's. Who's rollin' in their 5.0?

I think most of us who grew up in the age of the early 8 bit era are.?

Edited June 3, 2021 by AtariNostalgia

[Gunstar]

7 hours ago, Mr Robot said:

Simplified... So may have a few ommisions.

 

1.0 worked but had some issues sharing the SIO chain with a few peripherals (the 1088XEL SIO2PC for example), it had an occasional issue where it would backfeed power to the Atari somehow and cause some weird speaker noise when it was switched off, the switch on the side was prone to breaking if overused.

 

1.3 fixed all of those issues and added a resistor required for tape emulation but changing the USB/serial chip for a more readily available one caused an issue for a few people with certain combinations of operating systems and computer hardware used when updating the Fujinet firmware where they could not get it to connect, there were some workarounds but it was never reliable. For the majority of people there was no problem at all.

 

1.3 fixed, fixes that issue with a few bodged on components and other minor but very fiddly fixes. 

 

1.5 does the fix properly. 

 

the still in development 1.6 will have a new SIO connector with better receptacles which will grip sio cables better.

 

 

So, what happened to 1.1, 1.2 and 1.4? Or is it the "in thing" these days with hardware and software version releases to just randomly leap-frog version numbers? And since it is random, apparently, you occasionally don't leap-frog, hence 1.6??

 

And I guess using the 1.0 power switch once for on and once for off when used every 2-3 days over a period of a month is "overused?!?" I've had chewing gum flavor last longer! I didn't know they made disposable switches that work about a dozen times...now I know.

Edited June 4, 2021 by Gunstar

[Mr Robot]

1.1 fixed something, 1.2 fixed some more before 1.1 became a pcb, 1.3 fixed some more and got to actual hardware. 
 

1.4 was skipped because 1.3 was so traumatic for mozzwald it needed some distance I guess

[Gunstar]

I guess in my mind set, it should make it all the way to released hardware to be the next version, anything else was research & development and practice and 1.3 should be 1.1. But it's the developer's prerogative if they want the in-between, un-released development mistakes to have version numbers I guess. To me, that's just trial and error on the way from 1.0 to 1.1.

 

Of course that's me accepting the reality of "something point something" versions that people have used with computer hardware and software pretty much all along. Personally I've always found it very tiresome and would rather it all just be version 1, version 2, etc. or Mark 1, Mark 2, etc.

Edited June 4, 2021 by Gunstar

[Atari8guy]

Of course that's me accepting the reality of "something point something" versions that people have used with computer hardware and software pretty much all along. Personally I've always found it very tiresome and would rather it all just be version 1, version 2, etc. or Mark 1, Mark 2, etc.

 

Yeah, I wonder what Windows 96 and Windows 97 were like, and don't get me started on Windows 99 and why they named it Windows 98 SE..... [emoji14]

 

Seriously though. Version control exists to help development. Not consumers. So they likely introduced stuff in a 1.1 revision that is stored somewhere as a mock up or maybe just electronically but the project and the developers can track what changes existed on that version this way.

[Gunstar]

I like to remind people of Windows 98 CE on the Sega Dreamcast too, since I'm a fan of the console. But if that crap weren't bad enough they go back and forth with years or version numbers and pepper in a few with names. And when you thought it couldn't get anymore ridiculous, the Xbox One is the third console, not the first, and what the hell was the "360" designation all about? If it's referring to degrees of rotation ability, and freedom of movement in a virtual environment, they are only a few decades too late for that mile stone! And as a matter of fact, I do believe Atari were the firsts in that department with BattleZone in the arcade and Star Raiders on the computers and consoles.

 

Don't get me wrong, I own and enjoy all three Xbox consoles. With a name like "Xbox" they should have gone with the classic Mark I, Mark II, Mark III designations...

Edited June 4, 2021 by Gunstar

[AtariNostalgia]

Or like the Windows XP Media Center Edition, which I still have stamped in one of my retired laptops...

[+Stephen]

1 hour ago, Gunstar said:

what the hell was the "360" designation all about

Pretty sure it was an indication of the how the red LEDs would show that your expensive console just died!

[Atari8guy]

You know what I don't get about Microsoft, right around the time the first XBOX was being developed I think all the Atari IP and name were sold for like 5 million bucks.  I feel like a huge opportunity was missed there, they could have had the name and returned Atari to all our living rooms.  I'm not saying I would support that, just seems like it would have been a big marketing win...

[Mr Robot]

Why would Microsoft need to spend 5 million on the name Atari? You don't think "Microsoft" has sufficient brand awareness? I know they had some push back with the first XBox due to it being from the evil M$ but that was the point of the first XBox, just getting something out there, the next release didn't have that stigma attached to it. 

 

[Atari8guy]

I’m sure 5 million was a pittance to what they spent on marketing. I just think there was an opportunity there. The name Atari evokes memories of gaming for a large chunk of the population. I see it as something that could have been a quick win. That’s all.

Of course I’m not a marketing expert. Just making conversation.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Gavin1968]

On 6/3/2021 at 2:56 PM, AtariNostalgia said:

History repeats itself

And there is a new iPhone every six months and people line up for hours to spend $1000+ on the new version.  It's crazy.

 

[Gunstar]

16 hours ago, 8bitguy1 said:

You know what I don't get about Microsoft, right around the time the first XBOX was being developed I think all the Atari IP and name were sold for like 5 million bucks.  I feel like a huge opportunity was missed there, they could have had the name and returned Atari to all our living rooms.  I'm not saying I would support that, just seems like it would have been a big marketing win...

I agree, I've always felt they should have bought the Atari name/rights too. Did they need too? Obviously not as history proves, but I think it would have shown some good will to the video gaming public, that here was a large successful company, that was stepping in to save a legendary name in the industry. They could have made Atari their video game console division and still let everyone know it was them with the caption underneath "A Microsoft Company." Like Warner did with the Atari name. Resurrecting and returning the Atari name to greatness with the similar corporate power behind it as Sony. Making Atari a division would have satisfied the public that this wasn't just a whim of Microsoft's that they'd drop like a hot potato sort of like their WebTV.  Giving public confidence in the Atari Xbox system's staying power too. They could have even hired Nolan Bushnell whether it was a position of some importance or just a poster-boy figure head "consultant." It would have just been so cool. Gates could of made an offer Bushnell couldn't refuse.

Edited June 5, 2021 by Gunstar

[mozzwald]

I would have replied sooner but nobody tagged me and I haven't been keeping tabs on the forum much. If you tag, me I'll get an email and be happy to answer questions.

On 6/3/2021 at 9:55 PM, Gunstar said:

So, what happened to 1.1, 1.2 and 1.4? Or is it the "in thing" these days with hardware and software version releases to just randomly leap-frog version numbers? And since it is random, apparently, you occasionally don't leap-frog, hence 1.6?

I use version numbers to keep track of changes for myself (selfish if you want to call it that  ). Each pcb ordered gets a new version number and made in a different color than the previous.

 

The changes for released versions are listed on the wiki and in the README for each hardware release.

 

 * 1.1 and 1.2 were test versions that didn't cut it (trying to add buffer)

 * 1.3 added open drain buffers for better compatibility with other SIO devices on the bus. The problems with flashing 1.3 were found out after release 

 * 1.4 fixed the flashing problem with 1.3

 * 1.5 has a few minor tweaks

 

On 6/3/2021 at 4:20 PM, Mr Robot said:

I'd even buy an 'unfixed' 1.3 and try to update the firmware. If it works for you, great, if not, ask to return it and get a fixed one for the couple of extra $£€ it costs for the annoying fix to be applied.

I wouldn't buy or sell an unfixed v1.3 FujiNet. You never know who will have problems and it's a waste of money and time (shipping) to not do the fix which is really quite simple (if you have the capability to manufacture a FujiNet). v1.3 with the fix applied work fine.

 

v1.6 is still a work in progress. I've been busy and haven't had much time to spend on it. As of now, the changes are:

 * Longer receptacle pins for better fit

 * Run MOTOR line thru buffer

 * SD Card detect pin to a GPIO

 

 

Edited June 7, 2021 by mozzwald
Bold so it stands out :D

[AtariNostalgia]

Can you save your own programs on the Sdrive or Fujinet?

They just arrived, haven't opened them yet.

[Mazzspeed]

Don't forget, there's also FujiNet-PC which runs off a Linux machine using an affordable FTDI SIO2PC adapter. I run this off a Pi400 and it works great.