+davidcalgary29 Posted December 23, 2021 Share Posted December 23, 2021 4 minutes ago, DavidMil said: You are a better person than I am. I guess that I've been 'burned' by people I trusted too many times. My hat is off to you davidcalgary29! DavidMil I really don't hold any expectations for anyone but myself, so I'm rarely bothered by bad behaviour. Hee! That seems really grim when I type it out like that. I completely understand your position, though, and it's a reasonable one. Still, if anyone wants to experience the A8 (or ST, or 5200, CV, and 7800), this might be the perfect way to do it without spending a mint these days. That's a nice thought. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fred_M Posted December 23, 2021 Share Posted December 23, 2021 I have given away a lot of (spare) items to many Atari users so that is my way to try to help people out. But lending out to unknown people is a bridge too far for me. 2 years ago I lended an AtariAge user 189 euros and never got 1 euro back. That user has made over 4000 posts here... Still, like DavidMill, my respect to you for doing this. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+davidcalgary29 Posted December 23, 2021 Share Posted December 23, 2021 Sending out things to people I don't know at all is one of the things that interests me about this "project" (is it a project? A thought? An idea?). New rule: everyone who borrows an item has to write an entry on a "library card" explaining when they got the item, and how they used it. And if anyone who's posted on this thread wants to borrow some of my equipment, don't be shy -- ask! That goes for my Jaguar and Lynx carts, too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mclaneinc Posted December 23, 2021 Share Posted December 23, 2021 David, I salute your love of spreading good cheer and being an all around nice guy, but I'd limit your lends to the US just to cut any risk down. Obviously it's your idea and if you already know the person to be of good character then go for it. Also I'd keep it to software etc as machines are too tempting for some of the dregs that visit web forums looking for gear. All the very best, Paul.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jhd Posted December 23, 2021 Share Posted December 23, 2021 1 hour ago, Mclaneinc said: David, I salute your love of spreading good cheer and being an all around nice guy, but I'd limit your lends to the US just to cut any risk down. I have no interest in borrowing anything from anyone, but I find the recommendation that he refuse to loan things to his fellow Canadians utterly hilarious. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mclaneinc Posted December 23, 2021 Share Posted December 23, 2021 2 minutes ago, jhd said: I have no interest in borrowing anything from anyone, but I find the recommendation that he refuse to loan things to his fellow Canadians utterly hilarious. Oops, no offence, I just forgot where Alberta was (despite having been to Canada and having family there), total and utter mistake.. Of course he should loan to fellow country people and even USA to make it as safe and close. Closes door and walk away in shame... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+davidcalgary29 Posted December 23, 2021 Share Posted December 23, 2021 5 minutes ago, jhd said: I have no interest in borrowing anything from anyone, but I find the recommendation that he refuse to loan things to his fellow Canadians utterly hilarious. C'mon, now, let's be nice. It's a simple mistake. I bought several machines from Curt many years ago, including a STacy, and should see where they are.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+davidcalgary29 Posted December 23, 2021 Share Posted December 23, 2021 2 minutes ago, Mclaneinc said: Oops, no offence, I just forgot where Alberta was (despite having been to Canada and having family there), total and utter mistake.. Of course he should loan to fellow country people and even USA to make it as safe and close. Closes door and walk away in shame... I appreciate all the kind thoughts, but I'll send my stuff to wherever it's requested, as long as it's not in a war zone or it doesn't cost more than $100 to do it. So St. Helena, Ile Crozet, and Kerguelen Island are probably out. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mclaneinc Posted December 23, 2021 Share Posted December 23, 2021 1 minute ago, davidcalgary29 said: C'mon, now, let's be nice. It's a simple mistake. I bought several machines from Curt many years ago, including a STacy, and should see where they are.. Yes as I posted, stupid mistake on my part, apologies all around to any Canadians who feel peeved, I'll probably get grief from extended family in Canada of which one is an Atari person who reads here sometimes.. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mclaneinc Posted December 23, 2021 Share Posted December 23, 2021 3 minutes ago, davidcalgary29 said: I appreciate all the kind thoughts, but I'll send my stuff to wherever it's requested, as long as it's not in a war zone or it doesn't cost more than $100 to do it. So St. Helena, Ile Crozet, and Kerguelen Island are probably out. As said, you are the Boss David, super commendable attitude by you.... I hope it all goes great for you and the people involved.. Really nice to see such warmth in a world full of pain... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Retro Rogue Posted December 29, 2021 Share Posted December 29, 2021 (edited) There seem to be a lot of misconceptions about things Atari Museum related past and present. 1) There was no "infighting", there is no one "ripping the museum apart". Someone with no connection to the Atari Museum tried to take over the website when the server went down. This is the same guy that sent legal papers and harrased Curt's widow with phone calls, emails, etc. for months after his death. Likewise he called around to storage units around Curt's locale looking to try and locate any he had and buy them out from under Curt's family's nose. I was and am a partner in the Atari Museum, Karl Morris (UK) was and is involved as well. I was chosen by Curt to oversee the museum and am legally named by him and his family to oversee that portion of the estate. 2) The Atari Museum is an actual archive and has been around since the 90s, it is not simply a website. There's the main part at Curt's in New York, and I ran a section of it from Milwaukee (before taking it over). It actively worked (and works) with Atari alumni to preserve the history of Atari Inc., Atari Corp. and Atari Games. Everything was professionally archived, cataloged, shown at various shows, loaned out to museums and institutions, and used to provide assistance for researchers and the like. Anyone that knew Curt knows he worked tirelessly at this, and besides building an established network of Atari alumni who donated a lot of his content he spent large amounts of his own money acquiring a good portion of the content besides all the money spent digging up documentation. (When we went and got the legal documentation for the Atari/Amiga lawsuit for instance, we weren't able to simply request searches for specific documents or content. So we had to purchase copies of all the documents in bulk (several boxes full) in its entirety and ship them over). It was never declared to be a non-profit, however I strongly resent the implication by the thread starter that not declaring as such somehow labels these long ongoing archival efforts as akin to an Ebay flipper. Curt certainly made multiples of some items in the archive available for purchase by collectors over the years or in some cases would sell less rare items to other collectors to fund more expensive acquisitions but almost always with a buyback agreement. The Atari Museum archive, in its entirety, represents the bulk of what is left of Atari Inc.'s Consumer Division as well as of Atari Corp. I was just at his place beginning the long and arduous process of cataloging everything item per item. Whether sheet by sheet of a large book of engineering schematics or a simple promo pin, it's getting individually recorded. I was there for five days doing it 12 hours a day and still only got through a 1/4 of what's there. That should give you an idea of the size of it. 3) I am going to do my best keeping the operations and efforts for Atari preservation that Curt started, going. That includes continuing to work with alumni, museums and archives, businesses (like the current Atari), etc. It includes going to shows to show items to the public. It also includes continuing forward with the second edition of 'Business Is Fun' for the 50th anniversary this coming year, and the website which is up but not finished because Karl and I are going through an extensive redesign based on what Curt originally wanted before he passed. I will also be expanding out the Atari Museum site to bring in other well known researchers and Atari alumni to be directly involved with its efforts. 4) If the original poster is still concerned, which is his prerogative, I would suggest contacting any of the well known museums that are declared non-profit to see about donating. Don't bother with the Computer History Museum in California though, they're not taking anything and are already filled to the brim. Which is a very real problem, as many places might never actually put an item on display (or very rarely) if that's what you're looking to happen. Quite often items will simply be stored in an archival warehouse like at the end of Raiders of the Lost Ark. Additionally, just because an entity is non-profit, that does not mean whatever is donated will not be sold to acquire other more valuable items. It simply means the goal of the entity is not to flip an item to make money for the people that operate it. They can still do so to make money for the operation itself. Either way, feel free to reach out to me via the Atari Museum group on facebook if you're interested in talking about the items you have. My mailbox is full here, and I don't delete old conversations (I prefer to keep them to refer to - which is why I have a huge gmail archive of conversations with Ted Dabney, Ralph Baer, and a host of other deceased and living notables as well as research conversations with Curt that I can still search though). Edited December 29, 2021 by Retro Rogue 14 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bfollowell Posted December 29, 2021 Share Posted December 29, 2021 That is all very wonderful news. Several of us had been wondering about what had happened to everything since Curt's all-too-early passing. It's good to hear he made arrangements and that everything is in good hands. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mclaneinc Posted December 29, 2021 Share Posted December 29, 2021 I echo that, I'm glad there was no in fighting, the impression was given from snippets of posts, glad it wasn't the case and there's at least 2 directly responsible people looking after it as Curt wanted. Shocking that a guy put time in to sending legal papers and harassed Curt's family, despicable... Good luck with your quest with the Museum, good to know there are folks with the same ideals and wishes as curt behind the place and finally getting some rock solid confirmation of what is going on.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ijor Posted December 29, 2021 Share Posted December 29, 2021 11 hours ago, Retro Rogue said: I am going to do my best keeping the operations and efforts for Atari preservation that Curt started, going. Hi Marty, May I ask you about the "famous" atari chip plots that Curt said he had and he was going to digitize? Many of us consider them invaluable. Here are two posts that Curt mentioned them: https://atariage.com/forums/topic/291908-atari-history-museum-updates/?do=findComment&comment=4287801 https://atariage.com/forums/topic/136706-internal-antic-and-gtia-schematics/?do=findComment&comment=1662683 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DavidMil Posted December 30, 2021 Author Share Posted December 30, 2021 First off, let me commend you for what you are doing to keep all things Atari 'alive'. That being said; what would you think if you had no information about what was going on except reports of the family being harassed and threats of lawsuits? I asked about the 501c status because I would like to get a tax deduction. There was no insinuations in the original post. I have first-hand knowledge of donating something to site that was 'supposed to be a documentation library (this happened before 2000). The person that I thought I knew moved out of state and kept all the original docs that people had sent him (including my original 'Imperium Galactium', and Cosmic Balance II docs). The best way to stop those kinds of rumors is to stay active in the community and keep people posted about what is really going on. DavidMil 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
massiverobot Posted January 3, 2022 Share Posted January 3, 2022 On 12/18/2021 at 12:57 AM, DavidMil said: Does anyone know if the Atari Museum is a 501c organization? I want to send some things to it, but I don't want to send it to a place that someone could sell it for personal profit somewhere down the road. DavidMil If you are looking for a safe place for historically valuable artifacts, the Vintage Computer Federation in Wall NJ is one option. It's a registered 501c3 charity. vcfed.org. Please note that donations: 1. Don't mean you get to dictate how, when or where they are displayed (if ever). 2. While you can get a tax write off for the donation, no museum will ever give you a value for the donation. That is for you and the IRS to work out. 3. What you believe to be of historical significance may not be. But there are plenty of experts around who can help evaluate things if you ask for help. VCF can may sell donated artifacts that are duplicates of no historical significance -- but they are never sold for individual's profit- the money is 100% used to fund VCF preservation activities. Note: former SteeringCmte Member of VCF Mid-Atlantic 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Albert Posted January 4, 2022 Share Posted January 4, 2022 @trapperkeeper Stop bringing up the XM module, I just had to clean up this thread thanks to you. The reality is, people who purchased an XM module are unlikely to get them or a refund. That's just my opinion, and while it could happen at some point, it would probably take substantial monies to continue the project through production and shipping of actual units. I bought two of them myself, and while it sucks that the XM was never finished, Curt was the nexus of that project, and without him it may be difficult for it to continue. And if it's true that you never even purchased an XM yourself, you are just trying to stir up drama for no good reason, and I'm not going to tolerate it any further. Let Marty do the research to determine what state various projects Curt was involved with are at (including the XM), and from there decisions can be made about how to proceed, if at all. Pissing and moaning about it isn't going to help at all. Thank you, ..Al 6 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SJD69 Posted February 28, 2022 Share Posted February 28, 2022 (edited) On 12/28/2021 at 6:33 PM, Retro Rogue said: I am going to do my best keeping the operations and efforts for Atari preservation that Curt started, going. That includes continuing to work with alumni, museums and archives, businesses (like the current Atari), etc. It includes going to shows to show items to the public. It also includes continuing forward with the second edition of 'Business Is Fun' for the 50th anniversary this coming year, and the website which is up but not finished because Karl and I are going through an extensive redesign based on what Curt originally wanted before he passed. I will also be expanding out the Atari Museum site to bring in other well known researchers and Atari alumni to be directly involved with its efforts. The atarimuseum.com site has been down for a while - is there a chance it will be working again? Edited February 28, 2022 by SJD69 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mclaneinc Posted February 28, 2022 Share Posted February 28, 2022 That's the plan, but it takes a lot of free time to do, I'm just happy that not only is it coming back, but it's going to be bigger. It would of course be a shame if all the hard work Curt and the contributors did came to a stop, I can't imagine Curt would have wanted that, so let's just wait and let people carefully plan this improved venture while we remember just how much Curt put into this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jhd Posted February 28, 2022 Share Posted February 28, 2022 On 1/3/2022 at 7:36 PM, massiverobot said: 2. While you can get a tax write off for the donation, no museum will ever give you a value for the donation. That is for you and the IRS to work out. So, the museum does not issue a tax receipt? Here in Canada, museums, galleries, libraries, etc. can issue a tax receipt for the "fair market value" of the donation. This may be determined by staff or they may use an external appraiser. Occasionally there is a dispute (between the donor and the institution, or the donor and the Canada Revenue Agency), but generally the process goes smoothly. One thing that museums will not do is provide a monetary appraisal of an item that is not being donated. And those requests are made frequently. (Personally, I was once asked to appraise an historic map over the phone -- sight unseen!) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
massiverobot Posted March 10, 2022 Share Posted March 10, 2022 On 2/28/2022 at 8:48 AM, jhd said: So, the museum does not issue a tax receipt? Here in Canada, museums, galleries, libraries, etc. can issue a tax receipt for the "fair market value" of the donation. This may be determined by staff or they may use an external appraiser. Occasionally there is a dispute (between the donor and the institution, or the donor and the Canada Revenue Agency), but generally the process goes smoothly. One thing that museums will not do is provide a monetary appraisal of an item that is not being donated. And those requests are made frequently. (Personally, I was once asked to appraise an historic map over the phone -- sight unseen!) Well, like I said, you get a 'receipt' for taxes. But it does not value the gift. That is up for you to determine. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KLund1 Posted February 8, 2023 Share Posted February 8, 2023 I have been wondering why just the web site can't just be hosted somewhere. It has/had already been up and running for many years. So the hard work has already been done. It has always been a very helpful resource for the Atari community. The web site should not have much to do with Curt's actual physical 'museum' so I do not see any reason why it can't be put up again. This is in no means a rant, nag, or anything like that. Just a concerned Atari enthusiast. Any thoughts on this? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+MrFish Posted February 9, 2023 Share Posted February 9, 2023 You can just pull it up on the WayBack machine. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
_The Doctor__ Posted February 9, 2023 Share Posted February 9, 2023 32 minutes ago, MrFish said: You can just pull it up on the WayBack machine. not exactly, it misses quite a bit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+MrFish Posted February 9, 2023 Share Posted February 9, 2023 2 minutes ago, _The Doctor__ said: not exactly, it misses quite a bit. Yeah, a shame it isn't perfect; but, I was able to pull all the Amy docs from it the other day. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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