FB3...

[jaybird3rd]

So is there confirmation that the FB3 will NOT be a 2600 platform?

Yes, Curt all but said so much earlier in this thread (see my quotation a page or so back).

...hmmm.  The XEGS idea sounds good, but isn't that still giving us a 2600 cart port?  I'd go for that idea.

No, the XEGS was the last incarnation of the 400/800 (a repackaged 65XE, actually), and as such it had a 400/800 cartridge port instead of a 2600 port. I'd actually like to see an 800 clone (with 64K RAM) instead of an XL/XE clone, because the 800 will give you four joystick ports and maximum compatibilty with old games. The XL/XE operating system adds compatibility problems and doesn't include anything that would be useful to the FB3.

When will we hear the word?

997177[/snapback]

I'd love to know myself. Edited January 10, 2006 by jaybird3rd

[www.atarimania.com]

I'd actually like to see an 800 clone (with 64K RAM) instead of an XL/XE clone, because the 800 will give you four joystick ports and maximum compatibilty with old games. The XL/XE operating system adds compatibility problems and doesn't include anything that would be useful to the FB3.

There are a number of good games from Europe that require the XL/XE OS. With arguments like this, no wonder the A8 didn't survive longer in North America...

 

--

Atari Frog

http://www.atarimania.com

[jaybird3rd]

There are a number of good games from Europe that require the XL/XE OS. With arguments like this, no wonder the A8 didn't survive longer in North America...

997425[/snapback]

True, but how many FB3 customers are going to be familiar with them? Given the choice between using the XL/XE OS for the sake of a few obscure games or using the 800 OS for the sake of several more familiar/marketable games and the four-joystick option, I figure the 800 OS is the best choice for the FB3 (which is, after all, going to be a game machine first and foremost). Opinions can differ, of course, although I'm not sure how that argument relates to the A8's longevity in North America.

[raskar42]

Hi there!

 

Regarding a 5200 Flashback, this is the complete list of all non-prototype titles Atari could put on it without licensing anything:

 

Centipede

Countermeasure

Missile Command

Realsports Baseball

Realsports Football

Realsports Soccer

Realsports Tennis

Star Raiders

Super Breakout

 

Definitely not something I'd be interested in...

 

Greetings,

Manuel

997441[/snapback]

 

thanks for the list.

 

 

I hope they do use the 5200, I sure could use another copy of centipede

[PacManPlus]

I was kind of hoping for the 5200; I think we all could use a *much smaller* 5200... Imagine a 5200 compatable console the size of the FBII...

Edited January 10, 2006 by PacManPlus

[www.atarimania.com]

True, but how many FB3 customers are going to be familiar with them? Given the choice between using the XL/XE OS for the sake of a few obscure games or using the 800 OS for the sake of several more familiar/marketable games and the four-joystick option, I figure the 800 OS is the best choice for the FB3 (which is, after all, going to be a game machine first and foremost).

So, basically, you're saying that the buyer needs to be familiar with every single game in the FB3? Heck, if there are just five newer, lesser-known games out of forty titles that require the XL/XE OS, why restrict yourself to a lesser system if you have the choice? Any old game that doesn't work with the XL/XE OS can be made compatible in a snap anyway... Apart from MULE, how many other classic four-player games are there exactly?

Opinions can differ, of course, although I'm not sure how that argument relates to the A8's longevity in North America.

It does. People are constantly saying there's nothing beyond 1983 or 1984 and they're completely overshadowing the European era. Antic or ANALOG didn't give a damn about Europe either and I always found those columns about the good old days pathetic. This led to zero renewed interest in the A8 line. At least they could've tried... See my point?

 

--

Atari Frog

http://www.atarimania.com

[kevin242]

Lots of 8bitters in North America continued using 8bits long after 83/84 sure software

developement was in a downswing, but there was still alot being released and there

were a ton of Express bbs's everywhere... I kept using my 130xe until sometime in

1990 (when I upgraded to an Amiga 500) it wasnt until around '89 when it seemed like

there very little new stuff coming out and the 8bit scene was dead (for games).

[jaybird3rd]

So, basically, you're saying that the buyer needs to be familiar with every single game in the FB3? Heck, if there are just five newer, lesser-known games out of forty titles that require the XL/XE OS, why restrict yourself to a lesser system if you have the choice? Any old game that doesn't work with the XL/XE OS can be made compatible in a snap anyway... Apart from MULE, how many other classic four-player games are there exactly?

I'm not saying that every one of them needs to be familiar to buyers already. I'd love to see some European games on the FB3; I think a lot of them (like Elektra Glide) would make great additions to the system, and earlier in this thread, I think I said that Atari should consider using them as long as they're written in English and as long as any problems with licensing games from another country can be worked out.

 

My only point is that, if it comes down to a choice between (for example) including an XL/XE game that hardly anyone outside of Poland has ever heard of or a more marketable 800-only game, Atari would be hurting their sales to go with the XL/XE OS if it means taking more marketable games out of the running. With a system as idiosyncratic as the A8, in which most games will work with both OSes while some others will only work with one version or the other, Atari will eventually have to settle on one OS for the FB3 and make some sort of tradeoff. How they do that really depends on what games they think will sell. If indeed it is trivially easy to "fix" the 800-only games, then it's a moot point and they should go ahead and do it, but that makes me wonder why somebody hasn't "fixed" them already.

 

It would be a mistake to disregard the option of four game ports; in addition to MULE, Atari 800 Asteroids had a four-player option that I remember having a lot of fun with, and I'm sure there are other four-player games I'm not aware of. Having four ports also opens some interesting possibilities for new FB3 games (which I'd also love to see); maybe these could include two-player modes for games that require two joysticks for each player (like Black Widow), or games that can link FB3 consoles together through the extra port(s).

It does. People are constantly saying there's nothing beyond 1983 or 1984 and they're completely overshadowing the European era. Antic or ANALOG didn't give a damn about Europe either and I always found those columns about the good old days pathetic. This led to zero renewed interest in the A8 line. At least they could've tried... See my point?

Ah, I understand ... you're saying that people thought the A8 was dead before its time because most of the press ignored new developments out of Europe. I can understand this argument, but I do remember seeing the A8 continue to get support in the States well into the late 80s; I was buying A8 games off of store shelves as late as 1988. It is true that the C64 and Apple II got support that the A8 deserved, though, and the C64 in particular wouldn't have seemed so impressive if more people had seen the work of the European demo programmers on the A8, for example. Edited January 10, 2006 by jaybird3rd

[kevin242]

this whole argument regarding the XL/XE OS and 400/800 OS is sort of ridiculous, it

would be very simple to include BOTH or even have a "translater" type prog for any

file that wont run on xl/xe os... rem these things are tiny tiny !!! the rom file

for OSB (400/800) is like 10k uncompressed!!!

[jaybird3rd]

this whole argument regarding the XL/XE OS and 400/800 OS is sort of ridiculous, it

would be very simple to include BOTH or even have a "translater" type prog for any

file that wont run on xl/xe os...  rem these things are tiny tiny !!!  the rom file

for OSB (400/800) is like 10k uncompressed!!!

997668[/snapback]

True, you could put the translator code and the game code together and go with the Xl/XE OS. That doesn't resolve the four-controller issue, though.

 

Of course, any speculation about the FB3 is kind of ridiculous at this point. We don't know for sure what Atari's plans for the FB3 are and won't find out until they're ready to reveal them and surprise us. I just enjoy getting excited about and speculating about an upcoming Atari console again; it's been a long time.

Edited January 10, 2006 by jaybird3rd

[raskar42]

Of course, any speculation about the FB3 is kind of ridiculous at this point.

997686[/snapback]

Now he tells us.

[deathtrappomegranate]

... heck the hardware wont even exist in proto form till about Jan-Feb...

I guess that we'll know more soon enough.

[netmoe]

Hello members, Will there be a contest in the future for designing the Box art, advertising, etc... for the FB3. Perhaps the winner can recieve a FREE FB3. Wishful thinking.....

Edited January 12, 2006 by netmoe

[raskar42]

Hello members, Will there be a contest in the future for designing the Box art, advertising, etc... for the FB3. Perhaps the winner can recieve a FREE FB3. Wishful thinking.....

999005[/snapback]

 

 

you already have a design, right?

[gdement]

Here's my shot in the dark:

 

 

It doesn't have to specifically be an XL or 800 or 5200 "clone". It's just another variation of the 8-bit line, and they can use an abstraction layer to make it compatible with whatever 5200 or 8-bit games they want to support.

 

Joysticks could be 5200 style sticks, but they would be digital, self-centering, and serial wired. Those could be significantly more reliable (and less expensive) than the original 5200 sticks, thus the improvement Curt hinted at for the system's original shortcomings. 5200 games would see only 3 possible "analog" positions on each axis.

 

A keymapper would map important keys to some buttons on the controller. The exact mapping would depend on which game you are playing. So 8-bit computer games could be built-in to the unit without need for a keyboard, and without modifying the original roms. Any new micro-carts produced for the system would contain a ROM header to indicate the appropriate keymapping, along with other compatibility information.

 

The serial controller interface could be USB. The system thereby might support a keyboard - but you'd have to provide it yourself. If you modify the system to accept 8-bit cartridges, you might need a full keyboard to run them properly, since the keymapper wouldn't know what keys to assign to the joystick controls. I'm most doubtful about this last paragraph, but if they actually support a keyboard, then doing it through USB seems as practical as anything else.

[Almost Rice]

Since we are fairly certain of the platform, could we discuss what possible games would be included at release? I think Star Raiders, Missile Command, and Centipede.

[+LS650]

Since we are fairly certain of the platform, could we discuss what possible games would be included at release?  I think Star Raiders, Missile Command, and Centipede.

If you're talking about 8-bit/5200, you have to include Star Raiders!!

[raskar42]

Koffi: Yellow Kopter

[Almost Rice]

If you're talking about 8-bit/5200, you have to include Star Raiders!!

1000716[/snapback]

 

Yes. If they are rewriting some code, I hope they can resolve the slow down each time we destroy an enemy or asteroid.

[kevin242]

If you're talking about 8-bit/5200, you have to include Star Raiders!!

1000716[/snapback]

 

Yes. If they are rewriting some code, I hope they can resolve the slow down each time we destroy an enemy or asteroid.

1001296[/snapback]

 

 

What? I dont think slowdown was invented yet! I really dont know what you are

talking about.

[Almost Rice]

What?  I dont think slowdown was invented yet!  I really dont know what you are

talking about.

1002255[/snapback]

 

 

If you play Star Raiders, shoot and destroy something. Now notice the slow down on the screen.

[+LS650]

If you play Star Raiders, shoot and destroy something.  Now notice the slow down on the screen.

Worse yet, shoot TWO on-screen objects (fighters or asteroids). As your spaceship dives through the clouds of debris, the machine almost comes to a dead halt for about 4 or 5 seconds.

 

Still, it's a great game; I've never seen another space combat game that matches it except the Jaguar's Battlesphere.

[+LS650]

So true. The genre amazingly evolved since then and most releases that came after it were a lot better, like Elite, Tie Fighter and Tachyon, to name but a few.

Huh? A lot of space combat games have followed - but I would argue that they are definitely NOT a lot better.

[jbanes]

Ok. Please argue why Star Raiders should be better than Tie Fighter?

1002621[/snapback]

Don't forget Wing Commander. The WC series is still better than the modern variations like X2: The Threat and Star Shatter. Wing Commander even has its own following of fans who've used both old and new codebases to create new games based on the WC Universe.

[jbanes]

Hi there!

 

Howdy!

 

I love Wing Commander

 

After X-Wing Alliance and Tachyon the genre almost died. But there's hope on the horizon

 

Looks interesting! Let's hope they manage to capture the spirit of Wing Commander rather than just "improving on the technology." (*crosses fingers*)

 

Still, I'm fairly well satiated at the moment.

 

[/end threadjack]